Let's Go Tribe!: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
New Blog: Voodoo Five for South Florida Bulls Fans!

Did Shapiro miss this one?

http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20061206&content_id=1752752&vk ey=news_atl&fext=.jsp&c_id=atl

If Horatio is all it takes to net a young fireball reliever on the cusp of closing, would not the Indians have some arms to deal? (Byrd, Stanford, Guthrie come to mind. . . i.e. a proven starter and a potential starter, or some mix thereof). If Soriano has been available, why not a single rumor that the Tribe is after him? Shapiro obviously has had no problem  working with Seattle in the past.
One could argue that Soriano = an expensive Cabrera with an injury history, but when healthy, he's dominant:
http://seattle.mariners.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/team/player.jsp?player_id=400089

Seattle lost out on Schmidt, and have plenty of cash to spend. Horatio has two good (middle rotation) seasons to his name (2003, 2005) mixed in with injuries and mediocrity.
And would anyone really mind going with Fausto in the rotation instead of Byrd?

Any thoughts?

0 recs  |  Comment 23 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
I was shocked when I saw this one. Schuerholtz made off like a bandit. Would've been nice to get Soriano.
If I had a nickel for every time I heard "...and Victor Martinez grounds into a double play", i'd be rich.

by Rayman on Dec 7, 2006 4:18 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
My thoughts exactly.
I guess one could argue that Horatio = Cliff Lee (and we don't trade Lee for Soriano), but that comparison is not entirely accurate until Ramirez takes the ball every 5 days for a few years in a row.

by DocNo on Dec 7, 2006 4:25 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
Ramirez - expected salary $3 million in arbitration.

Byrd - $8 million.

Seattle has huge contracts on Sexson and Beltre that they're saddled with.  Even if Cleveland offered Byrd, they would likely have turned it down.  We likely would not offer Westbrook or Lee, because Soriano has also had injury issues in the past.

Carmona?  Given how much time Carmona will be under team control, it is not likely we would have offered him for an injury-prone reliever.

The other thing this means is that Putz is off the market, if indeed he was ever on the market.

July 28, 2006 - The Andy Marte Era officially begins. Proud to be the unofficial Andy Marte Apologist.

by woodsmeister on Dec 7, 2006 8:27 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
I don't think DocNo was suggesting that we offer Carmona for a trade.  Instead he just wanted to put Fausto in the rotation so that we could trade Byrd or Lee.

by UndeniableMagistrate on Dec 7, 2006 9:00 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
My point here is that we didn't have a fit for what Seattle wanted - cheap starting pitching that we were willing to give up.  Byrd's too expensive and there's no good reason to give up Lee or Westbrook for a high injury-risk guy - that would be a significant overpayment.

Sometimes, you just don't have a fit for what the other team needs.  I have a hard time imagining that given the Tribe's need that Shapiro was not talking consistently with the Mariners about Soriano and Putz and just couldn't find the right match.

July 28, 2006 - The Andy Marte Era officially begins. Proud to be the unofficial Andy Marte Apologist.

by woodsmeister on Dec 7, 2006 9:07 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
Right Undeniable, I was not suggesting Fausto for Soriano. . .just that we plug him in the rotation and see how it goes.
Otherwise, Woodsmeister has a salient point. Just because no one leaked it does not mean that they were not exploring a trade here. They probably just could not find a suitable match.
I too had considered Byrd's salary as unbalancing the scale, but just thought I would toss it out there.

by DocNo on Dec 7, 2006 9:53 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
And since we kind of baked them on the last two trades, maybe Seattle didn't necessarily want to deal with us again so soon. Who knows. Could be plenty of reasons.

by talonk on Dec 7, 2006 12:51 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
Why would you assume Shapiro DIDN'T talk to Seattle about this?  It's an old cliche, but I think you're forgetting it:  For every trade made, there were 100 others that fell through.

I don't think there's a good reliever in baseball that Shapiro didn't at least inquire about.

by nickjs21 on Dec 7, 2006 1:53 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
Right.
Agreed.
Thread closed.

by DocNo on Dec 7, 2006 2:35 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
I assume Shapiro doesn't like Soriano's injury history and/or he isn't comfortable with a FA starter/putting Carmona in the rotation.  Hes also been spending all his time recruiting old relievers and a "utility" OFer.

by Brandini on Dec 7, 2006 3:06 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
Right, I seem to recall reading that he was only interested in acquiring people over the age of 35 because "they run funny when it is cold." <sarc> Give the guy some credit. He has done a good job so far in bolstering the pen and getting a 2nd baseman while still saving money to extend the guys we need to extend.
Wait 'til next year... or something like that

by fwembt on Dec 7, 2006 3:10 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
"they run funny when it is cold."
No, we run funny all the time.
Fan in Texas

by fanintexas on Dec 7, 2006 4:01 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
I'll grade the "bolstering the pen" as "fair" to this point.  Could it be better?  Yes.  Could it be worse?  Yes.  
When given the grade of "fair" that means hes essentially "done his job".
I do like what he has done with the Barfield deal, but it may look poor in 3 years if Marte fails, Kouz suceeds and Brown becomes reliable.

by Brandini on Dec 7, 2006 5:49 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
I had a hunch that this thread wasn't closed yet.
July 28, 2006 - The Andy Marte Era officially begins. Proud to be the unofficial Andy Marte Apologist.

by woodsmeister on Dec 7, 2006 3:13 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
Post of the week nominee!
-Erik

by drerikbrady on Dec 7, 2006 3:18 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
One of these days, I'm actually going to start keeping track of the nominations and hold a vote for the winner ...

by Jay on Dec 7, 2006 4:02 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
I haven't seen a nominee for a while to be honest.
-Erik

by drerikbrady on Dec 7, 2006 4:04 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
I gotta come up with some zingers, I never get nominated <sarc>

by talonk on Dec 7, 2006 4:03 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
I made Jay snort and had a beverage coming out of his nose once, that was a good day.  And that didn't even get nominated.
-Erik

by drerikbrady on Dec 7, 2006 4:04 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
When was that?

Did you used to be funny?

by Jay on Dec 7, 2006 8:14 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
I went back and looked it up, it was when I accused Wedge of mishandling Jaret Wright from the future.
-Erik

by drerikbrady on Dec 7, 2006 10:45 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
Oh, yeah, that was damned funny.

by Jay on Dec 8, 2006 7:13 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Did Shapiro miss this one?
See, told you I used to be funny.
-Erik

by drerikbrady on Dec 8, 2006 9:14 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Constantly updated Indians news, lots of in-depth analysis, live in-game discussions — and more fanatical and thoughtful Indians fans than every other web site combined.
Start posting about the Indians »

Join SB Nation and dive into communities focused on all your favorite teams.

Connect_with_facebook

Cbs_fantasy_baseball_promo

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recent FanPosts

Ketchup_small
Spring Training Photos: 3/12, 3/13, 3/14
Small
SB Nation Survey + Chance to donate $500 to a charity of this community's choice
Small
LGT Fantasy Basseball Roto League - openings remain
Cleveland_indians_select_manny_acta_as_new_manager_small
LGT Yahoo H2H Fantasy Baseball League
Hans_small
Old Timey Baseball Photographs
Small
Bullpen Banter's Indians Preview and our Top 25 Prospects
Dscn0271_small
The Pitchers 2004 vs. 2010
Scared_of_santa_small
top 30 prospects
Small
DYE
39135485-59af19dbb26654095f910f34176af094_4ae8a81e-scaled_small
Predictions Group

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

Featured Poll

Poll
Who would you most like to see in the rotation to start the season?

  176 votes | Results

FanShots

Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.

Recent FanShots

Mauer Signs 8-Year, $184M Extension
Gutz's 40-time Would Make Him an UDFA
March 20: Talbot Vs Athletes
Kerry Wood Out 6-8 Weeks
Acta's sabermetrics sermon paying off
Carlos Santana had one at bat and smoked a line-drive double. I know...
"We're excited, we potentially could have a rotation at Triple-A full of...
Tribe signs RHP Justin Germano to Minor League Deal
Five Questions: Cleveland Indians
Ron Washington Tested Positive For Cocaine?!!

+ New FanShot All FanShots >

SBNation.com Recent Stories

San Diego Padres' Tony Gwynn Jr. signs autographs prior to he Padres' spring training baseball game Sunday March 21, 2010 in Peoria, Ariz. (AP Photo/Lenny Ignelzi) +1 updates

Spring Training News & Notes, 3/20: Catching Up With Everyone

Chicago Cubs pitcher Angel Guzman, center, rubs the head of teammate Carlos Marmol, left, while chatting with Marmol and manager Lou Piniella, right, on the first day of baseball spring training Thursday, Feb. 18, 2010, in Mesa, Ariz. (AP Photo/Paul Connors)

SB Nation's 2010 MLB Previews: Chicago Cubs, Seeking Redemption

New York Mets starting pitchers Mike Pelfrey, left, Johan Santana, center, and Oliver Perez watch as teammates take part in drills during spring training baseball Saturday, Feb. 27, 2010, in Port St. Lucie, Fla. (AP Photo/Jeff Roberson)

SB Nation's 2010 MLB Previews: New York Mets, The High Cost Of Low Expectations

More from SBNation.com >


Managers

427px-nap_lajoie_1913_small Ryan

Dosequisman_small Jay

Authors

3444ant_black_small APV

47b8dd28b3127cceb64839d9746800000026102bauwjrq3za_small afh4