Peralta for Murton?
In the current edition of SI, Joe Sheehan of Baseball Prospectus lists five trades which he says would benefit both teams. Here's number five:
"Indians trade SS Jhonny Peralta to the Cubs for OF Matt Murton and RHP Sean Gallagher. Rather than move Peralta to second or third base to make room for Asdrubal Cabrera, Cleveland should trade him near the peak of his value for a much-needed corner-outfielder bat. The Cubs made do with fan fave Ryan Theriot at short this year, but Peralta, 25, is a clear upgrade. His below-average defense with the Tribe wouldn't be as much of a liability with the Cubs' high-strikeout, fly ball staff."
My first thought was, "Make room for Cabrera? He's the starting second baseman!" Rather, we'd be opening a hole in the infield, and as Jay and others have recently pointed out, it's dangerous to assume that Barfield can fill it.
Murton will be 26 all of next season. Peralta will turn 26. Gallgher, the wildcard of the deal, will be 22.
Career lines of note...
Jhonny Peralta
1,914 MLB ABs and this season closely mirrors his career average.
.336 OBP, .425 SLG, questionable range - though perhaps his defense is not as bad as when Jay joked that he had a paralyzed left side.
Matt Murton
If he's going to be an offensive force in the big leagues, it needs to happen soon. He's not a young prospect anymore; he should be peaking soon.
2007 with Cubs: 235 ABs, .352 OBP, .438 SLG. It's a slight downshift from previous MLB numbers.
MLB career: 830 ABs, .296 AVG, .365 OBP, .455 SLG. He's had a solid-if-unspectacular 87 walks in 830 ABs. But I'm optimistic there's room for improvement on the OBP side. His minor league numbers are not far off, with an OPS of .851 in 1142 ABs.
Sean Gallagher
I'd like to learn more about him. Interesting numbers with strong strikeout rates for a young age -- he struck out more than a batter per inning in AA at the age of 20.
Total minor league stats: 452 IP, 452 K, 387 hits, 179 BB, 2.75 ERA, 1.25 WHIP.
The Cubs did call him up and he made eight appearances out of the bullpen this season. He pitched 15 innings and got rocked, but who cares about that.
I'm curious as to whether someone like Joe would post trade ideas out of thin air, or if he has any inside knowledge. Likely the former, eh?
And would you make this trade?
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Comments
Re: Peralta for Murton?
by E5 on Nov 1, 2007 8:05 PM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
by Brick. on
Nov 1, 2007 8:08 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by Roger Dorn on Nov 1, 2007 9:02 PM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
by tabler84 on
Nov 1, 2007 9:13 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
figure out a good player on some team who doesn't matter who is probably dying to get rid of him who would be a nice fit for a major market team. propose trading for him with a major market team for their excess baggage they don't have room for anyway on a team that deserves to have an all-star at every position.
by Brick. on
Nov 1, 2007 9:18 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by fleerdon on
Nov 1, 2007 9:56 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by Brick. on
Nov 1, 2007 10:02 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by The DiaTriber on
Nov 1, 2007 10:48 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by Kos on Nov 1, 2007 9:42 PM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
by Toxicadam on Nov 1, 2007 10:01 PM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
No way Shapiro does this because Murton would not be an upgrade to our outfield.
E5, I would love to hear your reasoning for this.
On Murton, and why I do think he's an upgrade (for the record, I wanted him last year, too):
Yes, he's 26. This means little to me. It's not like he's just starting to hit in AAA as a 25-year-old. He's only in AAA because the Cubs couldn't find room for him when they moved Soriano to left. He mashed in AAA this year, just as he should. But he's been putting up OPS's of .900+ (not OPS+'s of 900--that would be unreal) since he was 23 in the Cubs' system.
On to E5's comment. As far as defense goes, no one who played more than 5 games in left field had a higher range factor (2.47) than Murton did on his team. A league average range factor in LF is 2.00. If it's offense you're talking about, here are his last 3 years in the majors, in OPS+:
132 (140 ABs)
104 (455 ABs)
100 (235 ABs)
Last year, these were the OPS+'s the Indians got out of LF:
Jason Michaels- 87
Kenny Lofton- 87
David Dellucci- 76
Ben Francisco- 105 (62 ABs)
As for career major league splits (Murton is right-handed), he has an OPS+ of 121 against LHP and 88 against RHP. So his OPS+ against his weaker side was still better than any regular Indians player had total in LF in 2007. How again is he not an upgrade?
Another note on his power. 2007's Baseball Prospectus loves on Murton and basically points out how all of his power goes into hard-hit line drives. Were he to loft that swing just a bit, they think his home runs would jump from 10 per season to 30.
The only reason I didn't post a lengthy "You are Mark Shapiro, pt. II" diary last night was because I couldn't find a good fit (this is probably what befell Sheehan). They don't have too many weaknesses that our strengths could exploit. I too saw SS as one of their holes, but ruled out a Peralta trade. Their catching can be found wanting, but would we want to trade Shoppach?
Anyway, don't everybody freak out. Murton, IMO, would be a good land. We just wouldn't want to overpay.
by nickjs21 on Nov 1, 2007 10:12 PM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
by Jackdaw on
Nov 1, 2007 10:28 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
And yet:
Ted Lilly
Carlos Zambrano
Jason Marquis
Rich Hill
Sean Marshall
ERA+'s of 122, 118, 101, 119, and 119. Hill is only getting better, and most are locked up for a little while. Three of them are left-handed, and only one (Marshall) failed to pitch at least 190 innings in 2007. I'm not sure they feel like starting pitching is a weakness.
I hope I'm wrong. I'd love to have Murton and I've been dying to find a taker for Lee.
by nickjs21 on
Nov 1, 2007 10:35 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by E5 on
Nov 1, 2007 10:38 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by nickjs21 on
Nov 1, 2007 10:51 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
Only when the wind is blowing out is it considered a hitters ball park. I am pretty sure if you looked it up it plays pretty fair and would lean to be a pitchers park. Slammin Sammy Sosa skewed the parks perception.
by E5 on
Nov 1, 2007 10:55 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
Historically, and currently (so Slammin' Sammy didn't skew anything this year and its still a hitters park)
by hans on
Nov 1, 2007 11:43 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by E5 on
Nov 1, 2007 11:48 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by fwembt on
Nov 2, 2007 12:11 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by homelytourist on
Nov 2, 2007 12:19 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by fwembt on
Nov 2, 2007 12:50 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by hans on
Nov 2, 2007 1:18 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by fleerdon on
Nov 2, 2007 9:44 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by hans on
Nov 2, 2007 4:10 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by fleerdon on
Nov 3, 2007 1:49 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by hans on
Nov 3, 2007 2:00 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by fwembt on
Nov 1, 2007 11:47 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by nickjs21 on
Nov 2, 2007 12:18 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by nickjs21 on
Nov 2, 2007 12:24 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by woodsmeister on
Nov 2, 2007 8:08 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by Brick. on
Nov 2, 2007 12:18 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
Let's take this thread up a notch. How about Cliff Lee for Elijah Dukes.
by homelytourist on
Nov 2, 2007 12:16 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
However, before I really delve into his capabilities, I think it's well-established that Shapiro is a character-oriented person. In my opinion, this isn't a trade he considers.
Take it the same way you'd look at trading for a brittle, injury-prone player. The talent is there, but will you sink cost into someone who could miss a lot of games? He threatened to kill the mother of his children, remember. People not liking Schilling wouldn't bother me if I'm Mark. People not liking Dukes ... that's legitimate.
by nickjs21 on
Nov 2, 2007 12:22 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
I'm all for giving troubled players second chances, but this sounds like an extreme case.
by homelytourist on
Nov 2, 2007 12:45 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
He texted a picture of a gun to her. That's weird.
by nickjs21 on
Nov 2, 2007 12:52 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by Brick. on
Nov 2, 2007 10:49 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by Joe on Nov 1, 2007 11:19 PM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
by cheech99 on Nov 1, 2007 11:49 PM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
Lastings Milledge
Matt Murton
Chris Duncan (lefty)
Jason Bay (I can't believe no one thought of him)
Matt Kemp
Reed Johnson? (31)
Elijah Dukes
Luke Scott? (lefty) (30)
I rate Milledge, Bay, and Kemp hard-to-gets with Kemp at the top of that list. Duncan and Dukes would cost a bit. Does Johnson have any chance of repeating his 2006? Probably not, if we look at his career numbers. And Luke Scott is primarily a center fielder, and a lefty, but the Astros don't seem to be crazy about him.
Oh hell, let's just trade for an Adam Jones/Felix Hernandez combo and be done with it.
by nickjs21 on Nov 2, 2007 12:49 AM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
Not to say that Torre won't play youngsters, but a part of me tends to think that Colletti (sp?) is going to load up on veterans and players that Torre feels will help him.
Will that come at the expense of guys like Kemp, Ethier, and Loney? As a fan of a team that would love to have any of them, I hope.
by The DiaTriber on
Nov 2, 2007 8:49 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
So that doesn't bode well, but you and I feel the same.
by nickjs21 on
Nov 2, 2007 9:08 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by Brick. on
Nov 2, 2007 10:52 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by ClarkM on Nov 2, 2007 1:04 AM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
by hans on
Nov 2, 2007 1:15 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by woodsmeister on
Nov 2, 2007 8:13 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
Cliff Lee is probably not going to bring back anybody who would provide an upgrade in left. I am not sure why you thought I was suggesting we should trade Lee for him or that Cliff Lee is the only guy on our team we can trade. Hamilton had a great year, so we are going to have to give up something to get him, and if they want too much, then tell them to forget about it.
by ClarkM on Nov 2, 2007 10:06 AM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
I doubt we'd flip Laffey because he's a lefty groundballer under our control cheap for the next few years. They wouldn't take Lee because of his extreme flyball tendencies. Would Sowers and a prospect or two for Hamilton get the job done? I have doubts - Sowers value has never been lower, and Shapiro has been very reluctant to give up prospects. I'd love to have Hamilton - I think he'd thrive on this club. But I don't think we have the pieces that the Reds need.
by woodsmeister on
Nov 2, 2007 11:01 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
I wonder how high the ceiling will be for Laffey, as he is a prodeminetly GB pitcher, I mean maybe Westbrook would be an example, he certainly isn't in Carmona's class as far as power arm goes. This being said, I really do like the guy and think he is probably the best bet to have a good season of this group: C.Lee, Laffey, Sowers, going for that 5th spot in the rotation.
by hans on
Nov 2, 2007 11:18 AM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
They seem to have a hole at 3B. Maybe we could entice them with Blake or Marte? We know Charlie loves those Cleveland guys [sarc].
by talonk on Nov 2, 2007 11:00 AM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
by ASP on
Nov 2, 2007 1:04 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
Ugh.
His mellow looks like armor, people.
by afh4 on Nov 2, 2007 3:19 PM EDT 0 recs
Re: Peralta for Murton?
by tabler84 on
Nov 2, 2007 3:48 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
Actually, you are going to be nauseated. The idea that we would trade Peralta is one you find nauseous. This is one of those common grammar misusages that just grates on my nerves.
Professional editor hat off.
Nothing personal here. Though I will say that Mellow Looks Like Armor would be a pretty cool band name, maybe for a trance or trip-hop group.
by woodsmeister on
Nov 2, 2007 3:56 PM EDT
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Re: Peralta for Murton?
by gahnki on
Nov 2, 2007 4:19 PM EDT
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No offense, but the problem with trading Peralta
Hello gahnki,
I understand your point about trading Peralta - he shouldn't be untouchable, but unless the deal is a great one for us, I can't see the Indians doing it, and I don't think Murton/Gallagher qualifies.
Plus, you have to consider that while Cabrera could certainly replace Peralta defensively at SS (and likely be an upgrade defensively,) you would lose some overall offense (I think Murton at best MIGHT be comparable to Peralta offensively, but I have my doubts on Murton reaching it, especially in his first season in the AL playing regularly - hmm... doesn't that sound a bit like Michaels' 2006 season? I think Murton does have more power than Michaels does and more potential, but I could see Murton falling short of expectations in 2008 like Michaels did in 2006, if Murton were to play everyday and to play in the AL regularly for the first time.)
Even more concerning though is the fact that Barfield would HAVE to stick at 2B if Cabrera replaces Peralta at SS; while Barfield's defense is solid enough, there are still considerable questions about whether Barfield will hit enough, and could be a potential downgrade from Cabrera offensively at 2B (I know Cabrera only had 150 reg. season ABs compared to Barfield's 420 reg. season ABs, so it's possible Cabrera will have to make some adjustments as more teams get more of a scouting report on him, but I was more impressed with his approach at the plate than I was Barfield's, SSS or not.)
Plus, Scott Boras is Barfield's agent, and as been speculated on here before, it's quite possible Barfield could be trade bait himself in the coming seasons before he becomes a FA, so the Indians probably have already considered their future without Barfield at 2B, even though they've only had him on the roster for one season.
Therefore, that's why I think the return for Peralta would have to more than "reasonably improve" the team to trade Peralta in any deal because you have the potential to lose a lot of offense from Peralta's bat, plus you have Barfield's uncertainty, both with his bat and with his long-term future as an Indian.
Just my 2 cents. :-)
by indiansfan on
Nov 2, 2007 11:38 PM EDT
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Re: No offense, but the problem with trading Peral
by hans on
Nov 3, 2007 1:48 AM EDT
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Re: No offense, but the problem with trading Peral
by mpstable on
Nov 3, 2007 11:16 AM EDT
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Re: No offense, but the problem with trading Peral
by Jay on
Nov 3, 2007 10:43 PM EDT
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At the rate he's asking for A-Rod's extension,
by indiansfan on Nov 3, 2007 9:06 PM EDT 0 recs








