Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Ok, I'll just throw out this trade proposal.
It's been mentioned before that the Tribe was at least considering Erik Bedard. My question is why not include Brian Roberts in the deal too. Too expense? Well not really, just listen to what we have to offer.
The Orioles have traded away their starting shortstop, and we may have one to offer that may have his highest trade value in years. His name is Jhonny Peralta. He is owed about $12 million between 2008-11. The bonus is AsCab can get his natural position back
Roberts is owed $14 million and change in the next two years. He is a career .281 batting average, and while he has limited power he stole 50 bases and scored 103 runs last year. His defense is also solid. In 2007 he had 7 errors and a .991 fielding percentage.
Bedard is arby eligible for the next 2 years and earned less than $4 million last year.
What would it take to get him? How about a package that included a shortstop, Peralta,a second baseman, Barfield (to replace Roberts), a ML ready OF, Francisco, a prospect 1B/ OF Jordan Brown, and ML ready SP, Aaron Laffey.
Still too expense you say. Well how about checking to see if St. Louis might want to offload an Anthony Reyes for a Cliff Lee (as rumored a few weeks ago). Lee is owed $3.75M in 08, $5.75M in 09 and has a $8M option 10. Now do we have the money? Still interested? I am.
Could it happen? Maybe. Will it? Probably not. Could it improve both teams? I think so.
I'd at least make a call
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Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
In my dream world we could get them to take Lee as a reclamation project (just affordable, tradeable upside come next July if it works) and a couple of lower pitching prospects. Probably would still have to include Miller though.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
It just hard to see ANY team placing much value in Barfield, Francisco or Brown at the moment. I'm high on Brown, but most people are wild about light hitting first baseman.
I'd love for Perlata to be of value to ANYONE, but I just don't see him working out with the Orioles rebuilding time frame.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Bedard and Roberts would be terrific additions to the Indians, but I can't imagine that the proposed package would satisfy the O's. Since Haren has been traded, Bedard, with his two years remaining under contract, is the most valuable trading chip on the market.
There is supposed to be serious interest from the Reds and the Mariners. I'm sure other teams are also in discussions with Baltimore.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
I love the trade idea, even though I give it a .00001 probability. Aside from JP already being pencilled in at SS, I think it would take more to pull it off, you'd have to add Miller to the mix. The competing offers for Bedard alone will be very high.
BTW, the latest from Dwags on cleveland.com (who has proved in the past to be a reliable source, take it as you will) is that:
Contrary to the SFGate report, Shap actually did offer Miller, Laffey, ACab for Haren, but was turned down, to his disappointment. And that he was inquiring about Roberts as a replacement at 2B if it went down.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
by Gradyforpresident on Dec 18, 2007 11:22 PM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Although if I could do that deal and magically have Roberts at 2B, I would. But the non-fiction version of that secenario means another trade with another set of our players in return. I just don't see Shap spending that much to get Haren initially, and then spending more on top of that to replace the 2B he lost in the first trade.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
by rustyparts on Dec 20, 2007 8:46 PM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Also, if the deal for Haren went through, we'd have almost no ML-ready prospects to offer Baltimore for Roberts.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Best no-cost option is internal, Barfield and Carroll being good defenders at least, with a hopeful rebound for Josh at the plate. It's not like you don't have ML experience there.
I could almost see Shap being so in love with Haren's contract that he would do that, even though me in the peanut gallery wouldn't.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
My guess is he meant Shapiro offered each one of those players in different proposals, not all three in the same package.
by Kos @ Let's Go Tribe! on Dec 19, 2007 6:39 AM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
No way to link directly - look for thread# 609683 in the ranges at the bottom. This was the beginning of that thread:
609683. Haren and Update
by dwags, 12/17/07 20:17 ET
Well, I was told today that the Indians were quite dissapointed that they didn't win the Haren sweepstakes, and that they felt their pacakge of Miller, Laffey and Cabrera was better than what the Dbacks gave them. It seems as if the Dbacks wanted to go with quantity over the quality the Tribe offered. Don't believe what other articles are reporting...the Indians were ready and willing to include Cabrera in the deal, and Miller/Laffey/Cabrera was what was on the table. I am told that all is expected to be quiet until the holidays are over. The Indians are casually keeping an eye on the Bedard sweepstakes (as well as Brian Roberts). But again, nothing imminent.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
by ken from alexandria on Dec 21, 2007 6:22 PM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Our AB leaders:
Sizemore
Blake
Peralta
Martinez
Hafner
Garko
Barfield
Nixon
Gutierrez
Who in there should be running more? I say we let Garko, Hafner and Martinez go crazy on the basepaths. Send them every time. Grady was 13th in the majors, 6th in the AL.
No, we don't believe in the stolen base. That is because Wedge is not so stupid as to attempt with our lineup. To ask us to indulge in that sort of ignorance is simply ridiculous.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
by Kos @ Let's Go Tribe! on Dec 19, 2007 6:37 AM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
by rustyparts on Dec 21, 2007 6:51 PM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Re-read what you wrote. Did you contribute anything new to the discussion? Can you blame anyone for responding to it with the same rolling of the eyes? And it's not because we are uncomfortable with the comments you make and that they bring things to light that make us squirm. It's because you talk down to basically the entire site and make the same comments in a condescending tone. Can we please have the post-hiatus E5 back? That guy was actually a pleasure to have around. He too made his opinions known, but everyone enjoyed his company. You've morphed back into the pre-hiatus guy, and I know it's somewhat a product of the environment around here bashing you at every turn. Let's start fresh.
by supermarioelia on Dec 19, 2007 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
by ken from alexandria on Dec 19, 2007 7:35 AM EST reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
by ken from alexandria on Dec 19, 2007 11:00 AM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
by ken from alexandria on Dec 19, 2007 8:44 PM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
His ML future, if he has one, is playing CF-LF, and keeping a high enough batting avg that his good eye at the plate pays off enough so he can bat leadoff. Even when he's not hitting, he draws walks at a very high rate. It's just a question of whether he's a .300 hitter or a .240 hitter. He's had stretches of both, his avg going down when he feels he has to be a slugger, going back up when he concentrates on just putting the ball in play.
His second half last year was actually pretty encouraging, with a 300+/400+/450+ line from July on. But its fair to say he needs to continue that at AAA before he's worth much in a trade or to this team.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
by ken from alexandria on Dec 20, 2007 6:27 AM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
This reminds me of the phenomenon where a fair number of Indians fans think that Broussard was a good fielder. They only think that because Broussard and Hafner were thought of as a pair, and Hafner was the one who could hit. By any measure, Broussard is a pretty bad defender.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
That's a great line, but let's keep it to ourselves, okay. I mean, we've gotta talk Crowe up if we want the O's to make this deal. Next thing you know, Bedard is in New York and Roberts is in Wrigley or somewhere.
by ken from alexandria on Dec 20, 2007 6:35 AM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Hudson is third-year arbitration and will be eligible for free agency after 2008. But these moves would give us AstroCab-Hudson with Carroll as backup for 2008. For 2009, we keep Carroll on a cheap option and move Josh Rodriguez into the utility role, or start him at 2B if he's ready for a long look.
The downside is that Arizona would have no interest in Peralta, so we'd have to have a second deal in place to spin him off -- presumably for Jason Bay.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
One guy I have been thinking about, although it's more of a trade for the future, is Chris Nelson of the Rockies system. He was a #1 choice from BP's high school, and although he started slow, he really came on last year and could blossom into a really good middle infielder.
He's blocked by Tulo and there are other SS/2B prospects in their system, and they need pitching.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Josh Rodriguez moving in at 2B in 2009 seems overly sanguine, though.
by ken from alexandria on Dec 20, 2007 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Agreed that Josh is far from a lock for 2009, or ever. But the bigger idea is that we have three guys who potentially could work out as a reasonable starter for 2009 -- Carroll, Rodriguez and Barfield. That seems like enough depth that it wouldn't stop you from making a move.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
by rustyparts on Dec 21, 2007 6:56 PM EST up reply actions
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Arizona is a good match on a couple of levels. They could certainly use starting pitching at the back of their rotation. I hope they feel they can do better than Doug Davis as their #3. Cliff Lee and change could be enough to get Hudson to the Cleveland. Peralta too, might be a quality addition for them. Given that their lineup posted a sub-.250 average for the year, they are one of the few teams that would be willing to overlook Peralta's defensive shortcomings because the offensive improvement he'd represent.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
And if we do put together a real package to get him, we get one year and Hudson's gone, the kind of trade usually thought of as a sucker deal.
Why would either team do it?
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
And if we do put together a real package to get him, we get one year and Hudson's gone, the kind of trade usually thought of as a sucker deal.
- They didn't sacrifice any of their middle infield prospects in the Haren trade.
- Why trade their best position player (I don't buy your premise)? As you mentioned, Hudson is gone in a year. That's why.
- The back end of their rotation still has a few question marks. Back end starting talent we have plenty of.
- Precisely because Hudson has only a year is unlikely to command an insane price.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
I would trade him for Lee in a heartbeat, I just think you guys are underestimating his value to that team next year.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
The ERAs of their #3/#4/#5 starters were - 4.67, 4.78 and 5.38. This was in the NL, mind you. Not to mention that the NL West features four other teams with uber spacious ballparks and three other teams with pedestrian offenses.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Anyway, I assume if they're willing to trade their closer, their lame duck second baseman is probably in play as well, especially given they managed without him for all of a grueling September and a division series sweep over the Cubs.
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
Re: Why not Bedard AND Roberts?
They might have an interest in Lee, but my immediate thought was that they might have an interest in repleneshing their farm system a bit, now that they've shipped five guys to Oakland and graduated so many to the majors in the past year.

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