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Pitching Health

It seems to me that one of the least mentioned but perhaps most important part of the Indians success recently is keeping their pitchers healthy. When was the last time you saw a Indians pitcher with an arm issue? It seems like every other team has 3-4 guys on the DL with shoulder/elbow issues. I guess Matt Miller has had elbow issues the last couple of years, but he is not exactly held a big role. Wickman before that. But there has been no problems with the starting pitching besides abdominal issues (which I will take all day over elbow/shoulder issues) since I don't know when. They've even managed to keep reclamation projects like Howry, Wickman, and Elarton healthy.

Is the tribe just better than everyone else, or are they just lucky? If it is the former, this is HUGE, and in my opinion the most important thing that Shapiro and is staff have accomplished.  

I hope I'm not jinxing anything by mentioning this, but in my mind it is a big deal, and I never see it getting any play in the media.

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Re: Pitching Health
Per Will Carroll, the Indians have one of the handful of best medical teams in the game.

The Indians' work on the mental aspect of player development is legendary ... What's not noticed is just how good the Indians have gotten on the medhead side of things. Since bringing Lonnie Soloff over from Cincinnati, the Indians have improved their stats every year and could be a top contender for the Dick Martin Award just by looking at their lights above. As with every other team that's considered a favorite, the Indians made a solid, discernible shift towards eliminating, managing, and containing injuries at some point and have an organized, multi-disciplinary plan for health in effect ...

From trainers to management, from GM to area scout, there's an organizational focus on proactive health. The one Achilles heel (no pun intended) is that the team doesn't do the best job at getting players back on time. Whether this is a more conservative tack for rehab or simply that they're just average at one part of the game is hardly problematic. Everyone has room for improvement, even this team.

Excerpt from the Indians Team Health Report, March 2006.

by Jay on Jul 3, 2007 3:24 PM EDT   0 recs

Re: Pitching Health
I'm getting kind of worried about CC's IP for the year. He is on pace for 250-260 IP if he stays healthy.

The most he had ever pitched was 210 IP in his second year.

by Toxicadam on Jul 3, 2007 4:06 PM EDT   0 recs

Re: Pitching Health
Yeah, it is alot of innings pitched. But CC works through the innings without many pitches.

The thing that has really struck me about CC this year is that he goes every fifth day regardless of off-days. The tribe has CC for 1 1/2 more years, you gotta push him hard.

by oxforddave on Jul 3, 2007 4:20 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Re: Pitching Health
It's my understanding that pitch count is much more important than innings pitched. Am I correct with this?

by world dictator on Jul 3, 2007 4:47 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Re: Pitching Health
You are 100% correct.  Pitching 300 innings is safe if the pitcher isn't regularly exceeding pitch counts of about 110, 115 (this of course depends on the durability of the individual pitcher).  Keith Woolner was one of the pioneers of this research in his days with Baseball Prospectus, and he currently collects his paychecks from the Indians.  I'm sure they're aware of this.

Just in case, though, a quick B-Ref search shows his pitch counts for the year:

98, 101, 113, 110, 94, 101, 113, 101, 105, 92, 110, 104, 111, 112, 116, 104, 111, 100.

In fact, there's only one instance all year when a starter (any one) was allowed to reach 120+ pitches, and it was a start in which Carmona threw 121 in order to finish the 9th.  I'm assuming this "don't let our guys go past 120" idea was made very clear to Wedge.  If it wasn't, well, happy coincidence then.

Long story short, CC should be OK.  /knock on wood

by nickjs21 on Jul 3, 2007 5:47 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Re: Pitching Health
To tag onto that, from I read earlier on this site per Woolner, high pitch counts themselves are not necessarily terrible either.

Rather it is the high pitch counts in pressure situations that put even more strain on the arm/body.

Let's just say that CC is pitching 120+ everytime out. If he is doing that and all the games are blowouts (+6 runs), that probably is not a terrrible thing (chancy still I know). But if all the games are 1 run or tied and he is still making those types of pitches near 120, that is when the high stress really occurs.

I hope I recalled that correctly.

by talonk on Jul 3, 2007 5:53 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Re: Pitching Health
"Pitching isn't dangerous, pitching while tired is dangerous" is paraphrasing the brunt of Woolner's work.  Every pitch thrown once fatigue sets in is almost exponentially riskier than the last one.  So while I'm not sure a high-stress situation was ever proved to be dangerous through his research, you could make the case.

by nickjs21 on Jul 3, 2007 6:11 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Re: Pitching Health
Innings pitched may matter also, but most likely to a lesser extent. One thing is certain. If CC pitches 260 innings the same way he has pitched in the first half (low pitches per inning), it will be the least destructive 260 innings to a pitcher since Maddux was in his prime.  

by oxforddave on Jul 3, 2007 6:05 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Re: Pitching Health
From what I recall, there is not much evidence that proves that simply pitch count or innings pitch causes injury. It has more to do with drastic changes in the pitches per start and innings per year. Neither of which C.C. is likely to have. Power pitchers should not be measured on the same benchmarks as finesse pitchers.
Andland

by andland on Jul 4, 2007 12:48 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

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