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Around SBN: Carmelo Anthony, Amar'e Stoudemire Vow To Fit In With Lin

The Mystery of Fausto Carmona

A year and a half after he first cracked the starting rotation, Fausto Carmona is still, in many ways, a baffling specimen to both Tribe fans and opposing batters.  As a young(er) pitcher, he was known more for his command than his velocity, posting a 3.43 K/BB ratio during his years in the Indians' farm system.  In 2006, when called up to the show, he became something of a power arm in the bullpen.  Of course, by now we all know the story of his failed stint as a closer at the end of that season and his subsequent rise to dominance in 2007, during which he posted a Halladay-esque 5.73 K/9 with a 3.28 GB/FB, making him the best groundballer in the AL.  His K numbers improved throughout the season (6.37 K/9 after AS break) as did his ERA, which ultimately made him a dark horse Cy Young candidate.

Star-divide

As great as Carmona's 2007 was, his 2008 has been. . . well, weird.   Looking at Mona's peripherals, you'd think he was getting rocked pretty much every start, or at least you might conclude that he's gotten super, super lucky.  Yeah, he's got that 2.25 ERA, but as we all know, these things are wont to fluctuate, and that stats like K/9, BB/9, and BABIP offer better ways to predict future performance.  None of these numbers have great things to say about Fausto: he's got a 3.54 K/9 ratio, walks literally twice as many guys as he strikes out, and his BABIP is .247, suggesting that some correction will occur.   Moreover, his defense-independent ERA is 4.97 (!).

However, he also has by far the best GB/FB ratio in the league (3.88, next best in the AL is Halladay at 2.74) he also has posted a LD% of 14%, good for 6th in the AL (interestingly, he had the exact same LD% last year, then good for first in the league).  He's also had great success at limiting extra-base hits, holding opposing batters to a .302 slugging percentage. 

Maybe I am misinterpreting the numbers, but I am beginning to wonder if it possible that Carmona actually defies the conventional "sabermetric model" of pitching success.  Essentially, Mona's peripherals, other than his monstrous GB rate, say his ERA screams fluke--nobody can sustain the kind of success he's had with those K and BB numbers. However, when watching the guy, I can't help but feel his stuff is so unique, the movement and velocity on his pitches are so great, that there's no way he's going to regress as much as the numbers would suggest (although expecting him to hold onto that 2.25 ERA is probably unreasonable).   I mean, calling him a sinkerballer is the understatement of the century--I've never seen any pitcher induce as many broken bats and high choppers in front of the plate.  Hell, it seems like half the hits he gives up are infield singles on balls that take too long to get beyond the pitcher's mound.

My question to the statheads/people who are interested in this kind of stuff: Is there a precedent for somebody like Carmona?  Are the factors driving his success--an outlandish GB rate and a very low LD% and opposition SLG--enough to sustain his ace-level performance?  Can a traditional statistical evaluation really account for this guy's ability to induce weak/off-balance contact?  I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

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Definitely not a baseball stathead here, but I can speak to stats as a topic. Statistical modeling is just that, modeling. Modeling is only meant to approximate what we experience. As time passes, we will invent even more sophisticated modeling tools and these may or may not encompass the Carmona experience. But, it’s helpful that you pointed out an example showing how the currently accepted measurements of pitching fail to capture Carmona’s effectiveness.

by elsandito on May 23, 2008 2:03 PM EDT reply actions  

“the Carmona experience”

I like it, heh.

by Cap'n Snegiryov on May 23, 2008 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

I really, really wanted this to be a mystery short story about Fausto Carmona.

by afh4 on May 23, 2008 2:25 PM EDT reply actions  

Holy ish. I got to locker house and lost it.

by afh4 on May 27, 2008 12:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

Me too. I love it when Tyler goes Guy Noir on us. Absolutely great.

-Erik

by drerikbrady on May 27, 2008 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

Is this story based on real life events?

by elsandito on May 27, 2008 7:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

Wow. Nicely done. Now we get to guess the gibberish-speaker’s identity?

Here are a list of possible suspects:

Franklin Gutierrez
Jorge Julio
Edward Mujica
Rafael Perez
Victor Martinez
Asdrubal Cabrera
Andy Marte
..
..
..
Carl Willis

Make your case.

And can "¿Podría demolar tu baño, Fausto?" be our new banner? Unbelievable.

by supermarioelia on May 27, 2008 9:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

"¿Podría demolar tu baño, Fausto?"

Just awesome. A Boodles for you, sir.

by Brick. on May 27, 2008 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

It was originally “Koona t’chuta, Fausto?” But the whole gibberish thing last night made that decision for me.

by fleerdon on May 27, 2008 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

You’re freaking brilliant. Sick.

by tabler84 on May 27, 2008 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ok, I’m hooked, how does it end? how does it end?

"It's hard to win when you don't score." Cliff Lee, 9/28/05.

by Harry Doyle on May 28, 2008 2:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

I really don’t think it’s going to get better than this for POTW.

Hard truth: Your eyes lie.

by AngG on May 28, 2008 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

+1

"It's hard to win when you don't score." Cliff Lee, 9/28/05.

by Harry Doyle on May 29, 2008 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

You’re all too kind.

by fleerdon on May 30, 2008 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

I feel like Mario is my Canadian brother. That’s the first thing that came to my mind, too.

Il faut d'abord durer.

by CU Adam on May 23, 2008 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Holy God that’s exactly what I thought. Let’s stick with “Fausto.”

by tabler84 on May 23, 2008 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

no way dude

“The Mystery of Fausto Carmona” is the coolest name for a post ever

although if I were to write a mystery story about him, it would have something to do with why he always leaves his shirt tag sticking out.

by Cap'n Snegiryov on May 23, 2008 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

He means when you called him Mona. Don’t get defensive.

Il faut d'abord durer.

by CU Adam on May 24, 2008 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mona. Who’s The Boss? You’re too young.

by Jay on May 23, 2008 7:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

The fact that people here don’t know who that is makes me feel older than just about anything else that’s happened in my life.

Il faut d'abord durer.

by CU Adam on May 24, 2008 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

I know who it is—it’s Jessica Tate.

"A good body with a dull brain is as cheap as life itself."

by Fiddlesticks on May 24, 2008 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

Just looked it up on imdb, she was nominated for a Best Actress Emmy in all four seasons and won a Golden Globe. Man, I loved that show when I was about 12. It was canceled by that point, but they were showing it every day around 4:00 in syndication.

by Jay on May 24, 2008 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, at least they know who Alyssa Milano is.

by Jay on May 24, 2008 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

So does most of MLB… hey-o!

by gte619n on May 27, 2008 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wasn’t she on Soap as well?

by talonk on May 27, 2008 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

see above references to Jessica Tate and Emmy awards.

"A good body with a dull brain is as cheap as life itself."

by Fiddlesticks on May 27, 2008 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ok, never knew heer charater name from the show, and no mention of the show above. Thanks.

by talonk on May 27, 2008 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

You should have posted in the theme song as well.

-Erik

by drerikbrady on May 27, 2008 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

68% of his batted balls end up as ground balls. Hidden behind the wave of mutilation (mutilation of our eyes after watching this pathetic spetical) that is the Cleveland Indians Offense this year, has been a pleasent surprise. Our infield defense appears to be pretty good. Our defensive efficiency ratio (DEF) in Carmona’s starts is .733 and is .707 overall (for all of our pitchers) this season, which is 4th in the AL.

by hans on May 23, 2008 3:11 PM EDT reply actions  

This is a good post and brings up a topic that we’ve been kicking around for a while RE: the groundballers. Looking at the system it seems that the Indians know something about the extreme GB guys that even the advanced SABR thinking isn’t capturing.

Fausto being the prime example, but Laffy, Westbrook, etc…

by gte619n on May 23, 2008 3:58 PM EDT reply actions  

When you say “advanced SABR”, you are seeing only those measurements that have been made public. There ceases to be a competitive advantage when everyone in baseball knows a measurement, which is why the public is given these. So it’s possible that a number of teams already have an effectiveness measurement that more accurately includes GB within it. Ya gotta think the Indians would be one of the teams, given the resulting pitchers coming out of the minors.

by elsandito on May 23, 2008 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

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