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Casey Blake

Hi guys, I'm a Rays fan (as the name implies), and I have some questions about Casey Blake and his situation with the Indians.

First, I noticed a post talking about Blake possibly being a Type A free agent.  However, do you think it is likely that Blake would accept an offer of arbitration?  He makes $6.1 million this year, and would likely make at least that much if he went to arbitration.  I just can't see him getting $6.5-7 million per year on the open market. 

 

Second, what type of return do you guys think Shapiro would be looking for for Blake?  Would it be mostly a salary dump/roster space move, with a couple of low-mid level prospects, or would Shapiro try to get a really solid prospect?

 

Third, I don't know much about Blake other than his offensive stats.  How is his defense, especially in RF?  And how is he regarded as a teammate/clubhouse presence?

Thanks in advance!

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by still ill on Jul 19, 2008 11:26 PM EDT   0 recs

I’ll second that.
More to your point, though: Blake will probably be looking for a deal of at least a couple years, so it is possible, but not likely, that he would accept arbitration. As far as what the Indians would expect in return, the consensus around here, at least, is that we should receive at least a decent prospect for him. It is not likely that it would be a salary dump. Blake is average to above-average in right, mostly because he has a pretty good arm for the position. He is regarded by the Indians as a great clubhouse guy, as well.

by bewwolv on Jul 19, 2008 11:29 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Better than that, the Indians probably would be willing to pay Blake’s whole salary for the rest of the season, as long as the prospect we’re getting back is legit.

by Jay on Jul 19, 2008 11:32 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Didn’t mean to infringe on you right of response, Jay, this being your blog and all.
Agreed on the Indians paying the deal though, this has been their M.O. in the past, to make sure that they get a decent prospect back.

by bewwolv on Jul 19, 2008 11:34 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Blake could easily get a $6 million deal on the open market, if he were willing to take a one-year deal.

What he’ll actually do is hold out for a three-year deal in the range of $16 million, possibly more. While that would be a lower average annual salary than just accepting arbitration, his agent no doubt will advise him that at his age, he should go for the deal with the highest guaranteed total.

I do not think he would accept arbitration from the Rays. There is a small but significant chance he would accept it from the Indians, his team since 2003.

by Jay on Jul 19, 2008 11:32 PM EDT   0 recs

mega-rec

by SuddenSam on Jul 19, 2008 11:45 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

ssssssshhhhhh…..all of you stop with your blasted recs, i’m negotiating here

by supermarioelia on Jul 19, 2008 11:56 PM EDT to parent up   1 recs

a vacuum if you will

by Brick. on Jul 19, 2008 11:57 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

ya that was awesome.

Dear Mr. Sabean, I hear you have a reputation of being stupid. Want to deal Lincecum or Cain? You can pick THREE of these 4 players for either: Borowski, Dellucci, Blake, Byrd.

by westbrook on Jul 20, 2008 12:36 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I laughed at this for a solid 10 seconds.

Dear Mr. Sabean, I hear you have a reputation of being stupid. Want to deal Lincecum or Cain? You can pick THREE of these 4 players for either: Borowski, Dellucci, Blake, Byrd.

by westbrook on Jul 20, 2008 12:34 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

This is the best thing that’s happened all day.

I’m having a pretty bad day, but even so. That was spectacular.

Il faut d'abord durer.

by CU Adam on Jul 20, 2008 7:56 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Hmmm…a midlevel prospect? I think we’ve got a few of those that aren’t doing us a whole lot of good right now, especially pitching, like James Houser (AA), Heath Rollins (A+), and Alex Cobb (A). I would love to see the Rays work a deal for Blake.

To be fair and honest, I’m probably in the minority of Rays fans for wanting Blake. Most want Bay, Holliday, or Nady, but all of those guys scare me for one reason or another. Holliday has atrocious home/road splits, Nady is having a career year which I don’t think he can sustain, and Bay would cost a ton in prospects. The only guy I think would be better than Blake is Jayson Werth, but the Phils are in contention, so that may not be as doable.

by raysrule07 on Jul 19, 2008 11:52 PM EDT   0 recs

blake you would be getting for depth and flexibility. stating the obvious, those other guys would provide something very different and cost a heck of a lot more.

by Brick. on Jul 19, 2008 11:57 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

We were pretty obsessed with the dazzling bauble that is Jason Bay for a while.

by afh4 on Jul 19, 2008 11:59 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

First, the arb stuff is going to be answered accurately by Jay. But, no, I don’t think he’ll take arbitration from the Rays. He can easily make that much on the open market; Mike Lowell is making 12 million a year and Blake and Lowell are more similar than most people would think at this point in their careers. Plus, Lowell’s deal is going to be a couple of years old. Casey will get a mini-Lowell deal I’d think, probably some like 3/24.

I think he’d take arbitration from the Indians. This is an argument Jay has made persuasively; certain types of players will do it in gratitude to their teams, going to arbitration, then leaving for FA. It gives the team a draft pick at no cost.

Second, what type of return do you guys think Shapiro would be looking for for Blake? Would it be mostly a salary dump/roster space move, with a couple of low-mid level prospects, or would Shapiro try to get a really solid prospect?

If he’s trading, Shapiro is going to the table with a big sign that says “Casey Blake, Free!” The Indians are going to eat his remaining salary in order to maximize return. This has been Dolan and Shap’s MO for a while. It’s not going to be a salary dump or roster clearing. Casey Blake is useful; in fact, right now he’s probably more useful than he’s ever been.

So, I think you’re looking at a David Price or Wade Davis type.

Zing! Kidding.

In all seriousness, your comp deals are the Broussard and Perez trades from 2006, suped up a little bit. Shapiro is a good trading partner in that he tends to be involved in deals that allow other teams to deal from a position of strength. This was on display with the CC situation-Milwaukee just has too many hitters to use and we took some.

For the Ray, your depth is obviously in pitching as well as a bit in CF and C. We don’t want any more outfielders and we’re alright at catcher.

I think the list is going to look something like this and I would look for a deal that involves a huge ceiling guy who’s under 20 and a guy who’s a little more advanced but not all that good:

Eduardo Morlan
Jeremy Hellickson
Alex Cobb
Nick Barnese
Heath Rollins
James Houser
Mitch Talbot
Glenn Gibson
Chris Mason

I would want to see a player like Hellickson, Houser or Morlan as the centerpiece but that might be a little ambitious. I think more likely is something like Talbot or Mason, both of whom the sheen is probably off and aren’t really needed with Price, McGee, and Davis so close, and then one of Cobb, Barnese, or Rollins. We sort of have a thing for depth starters.

I could see them doing Hellickson, Houser, or Morlan straight up.


Third, I don’t know much about Blake other than his offensive stats. How is his defense, especially in RF? And how is he regarded as a teammate/clubhouse presence?

His defense is fine all over the diamond and not great anywhere. He’s considered a superior athlete. His weakest defense is, I think at 3B. He hits well, especially this year. He has a big beard, which people tend to associate with leadership.

by afh4 on Jul 19, 2008 11:57 PM EDT   0 recs

i too think the (center)piece we’d look for from the rays would be pitching.

by Brick. on Jul 20, 2008 12:03 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Hellickson isn’t going to happen, at least not for Blake. BA ranked him #22 on their midseason prospects list, right behind Wade Davis. The rest of those guys you mentioned would definitely all be in play. I would do Houser straight up, and I think Friedman would as well. There is no reason for him to still be in AA. I could also see a deal of Cobb and a AAA reliever such as Chris Mason, Nick Debarr, or Dale Thayer.

I love playing GM, but point is, Andrew Friedman has done a good job in trades so far, and Shapiro seems like a reasonable GM (have you seen the Rockies’ demands for Holliday? Yikes!), so I am confident that if the Rays decide that Blake is the best option, something will get done that benefits both sides.

by raysrule07 on Jul 20, 2008 1:30 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Let’s do Hellickson. That K to walk is the sex.

by Joe. on Jul 20, 2008 10:18 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I happen to think he’s better in RF than at 3B. In RF, he has a very good arm that and you won’t have to worry about all the balls that get between him and our slow-ass fat power-hitting shortstop Jhonny Peralta. I happened to like Blake when he was an outfielder. Last year, I hated him… and this year, I can’t say I’d be 100% thrilled with unloading him.

For your case, Mr. Rays Fan, hope you get the good and not the bad.

Dear Mr. Sabean, I hear you have a reputation of being stupid. Want to deal Lincecum or Cain? You can pick THREE of these 4 players for either: Borowski, Dellucci, Blake, Byrd.

by westbrook on Jul 20, 2008 12:42 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

While your expression of this is a tad bit overly dramatic, it is true that Blake grades out as a mediocre defensive 3B, above average at 1B, and far above average in RF.

by Jay on Jul 20, 2008 10:33 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

He has a big beard, which people tend to associate with leadership.

lol

One of these days... bang, zoom, straight to the moon...

by mixmasterasia on Jul 20, 2008 7:47 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I think I speak for all of Casey’s fans when I say that the Rays would be getting a guy who has blossomed this year into the kind of clutch hitter that he was projected to be. It would be a thrill for all of us to see Casey lead the Rays into and through the playoffs. You would be getting a clubhouse presence and a player who can play 6 positions. If Shapiro agreed to pay the balance of Casey’s salary, it would make the Rays transition entirely painless as he would not be asking for a major league player in return.

by elsandito on Jul 20, 2008 3:04 PM EDT   0 recs

Nice poker face.

by Jay on Jul 20, 2008 10:32 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

The fact is that, right now, Casey Blake is no worse than the forth worst Indian on the field. Without Blake the Indians this year would be truly in the tank.

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 21, 2008 7:12 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Geez, it’s early! Worst shouldda read best. Blake is no worse than the fourth best player on the field. Oy!

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 21, 2008 8:45 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Chuck … the Indians this year are truly in the tank.

Blake has had a great year, but that great year has been worth only two marginal wins for the Indians compared to a replacement player — 6 win shares above bench, 18 VORP. So instead of having the sixth-worst record, 43-54, we’d have the fifth-worst record, 41-56, and instead of a +9 run differential, we’d have a -9 run differential.

by Jay on Jul 21, 2008 11:01 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

But we’d have less grit. And a whole lot less to talk about.

by FredOx on Jul 21, 2008 11:11 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

OK, then tell me: who’s are the players that are better then Casey?

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 21, 2008 11:14 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Chuck, is anyone arguing with your “fourth best Indian on the field” assertion? Among position players, you may even be undervaluing him. The point is that the team needs more production generally, and by selling high on Blake, you may get it (for 2009 or 2010). Further, is Casey really likely to maintain production in 2009 at age 35 or 2010 at age 36? Note to the other 29 MLB FOs: the answer to that latter question is “yes, of course.”

by FredOx on Jul 21, 2008 11:21 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Where did I say there were any players better than Casey?

by Jay on Jul 21, 2008 11:53 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I’m just a little tired of the snide remarks about Blake’s ability. Yeah he’s got a beard, yeah he’s white and gritty and yeah there are better defensive third baseman. But damn it, he’s one of ours. We should be touting the players he have instead of pining for guys who’ve left.

BTW, I wanna be around when CC strikes Grady out with two on and two out in the ninth inning with the Tribe down by a run and CC does his little Joba/Papelbon fist pump thing. I’ll be interested in the reaction here.

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 21, 2008 12:01 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

So we’re not supposed to criticize any Indians player, ever? We’re supposed to think that all baseball players instantly become great once they put on their Cleveland uniform? And, of course, they’re terrible and must be hated once they leave.

The Indians are going nowhere this year whether Casey Blake is here or not. Will it really make you feel better if we finish with 76 wins instead of 74? Our goal this year should be to see what players we have that will contribute next year and what we need to change in the offseason. If we can trade Casey for a young player who may be part of our future, what would possibly be wrong with that? As with CC, he’s a free agent at the end of the year, so if he wants to play in Cleveland he can resign with us in the offseason. If Shapiro thinks Casey is a valuable player who can help the Indians he will try to resign him. Trading him now doesn’t change that.

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 21, 2008 1:17 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

In our zeal to suggest ways to improve our team, we have shoveled a high volume of snide remarks in Casey’s direction. Chuck is a rah rah kinda guy. Don’t hurt his feelings by bashing Casey.

by elsandito on Jul 21, 2008 1:24 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

It’s not the bashing that bothers me. I defy you to find a guy with a more negative view of Hafner than me. It’s the herd mentality/groupthink once again. I’m rah-rah about the Indians as a team but try to be realistic about the players as individuals. In the end I wonder about the group’s ability to evaluate baseball players at all when I read all of this crap about Blake.

And Brad I’ll tell you what, if CC signs with the Indians anytime in the next three years I’ll get you 50 yard line seats at the next OSU/Michigan game. If he doesn’t you owe me a Pastrami sammich from Slyman’s. How do you like those odds?

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 21, 2008 1:41 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Why don’t I get any credit for saying such nice things about Casey?

by afh4 on Jul 21, 2008 3:16 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Uhh, I never said that CC would sign with Cleveland in the offseason. All I said was that he could if he wanted to. That doesn’t mean I think that he will.

But I’ll gladly take you up on that offer. After all, a Pastrami sammich from Slyman’s can’t cost that much…..can it?

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 21, 2008 3:55 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I think the majority of the groupthink/herd mentality is not so much “Casey must go,” but more so “Marte must play.” In a lost season decisions have to be made, and it’s been frustrating to wait so long for the FO and Wedge to realize what needs to be done. Maybe Casey was an inadvertent lightning rod for this, but it was more the situation than the player.

And now we find ourselves with a respectable player on a one year contract. He can bring back value that helps us outside of this lost season. It absolutely makes sense to trade him, which leads from subconscious “Casey must go” chants to tangible ones. But again, it’s nothing against Casey.

Casey is what he is: A slightly above-average offensive player. On defense, he is a jack of all trades and a master of none.

I wish we didn’t disagree so much, Chuck. You and I seem pretty similar. I love this city and I respect the blue-collar residents. I hate the Yankees and I could really go for a Pastrami from Slyman’s.

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Jul 21, 2008 7:01 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

That’s a good point — Chuck and possibly others might be conflating the two things.

Earlier in the season, the prevailing view was that Blake was a declining mediocrity — so many of us would have preferred to see him make way for an extended Marte audition. (If Blake was any good at 3B at all, we would never have traded for Marte.) Not necessarily “make way” off the roster, but at least off of 3B.

As the season wore on, Blake put together a really nice season — but the rest of the team didn’t. So now we talk about trading him not so much to get out of the way, but because trading all veterans in their walk year is what you do when your season’s in the tank.

I mean, a team would have to be stupid not to trade their walk year guys at a moment like this, and the Indians aren’t stupid. When this happened in 2002, we traded every veteran who wasn’t either injured (Burks) or intending to veto a trade (Vizquel, Thome).

by Jay on Jul 21, 2008 7:21 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

So we’re not supposed to criticize any Indians player, ever? We’re supposed to think that all baseball players instantly become great once they put on their Cleveland uniform?

This from a guy who’ll defend any cazzi jadrool who ever put on a scarlet and gray uniform!

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 21, 2008 1:43 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Excuse me, but when have I ever defended any Buckeyes player? In fact, when have I ever discussed any Buckeyes player on this site?

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 21, 2008 3:49 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Hey Chuck, are you going to answer my question or just continue to make baseless accusations?

You know, I love reading this site and participating in intelligent baseball discussions. But it seems like there is a double standard here among the members. If you’re a “regular”, you can say whatever you want and get away with it from the other regulars. If you’re a guy, like me, who reads this site often and posts less frequently, you are bombarded by the members here for things you say that don’t agree with everybody here. And you’re assumed to need a lesson about advanced baseball statistics because (some people) think you’re new to them and you don’t know what you’re talking about.

I have posted comments the past few months and been told (a) that I had no idea what I was talking about (when in fact I did) and (b) that I was thinking/saying things that I never wrote or said. I don’t like it when people assume things that I mean without actually reading what I’m saying. Then when I write a reply telling that person that they are off base or trying to defend myself, they don’t feel the need to respond. And now we have a “regular” making competely baseless criticisms of me, and when I ask him to back them up he ignores me. If I had done that, people here would have been all over me. There is definately a double standard here.

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 22, 2008 7:34 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

If you think Chuck makes these comments and no one is calling on it, you’re just trying to paint yourself the martyr.

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Jul 22, 2008 7:38 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Wow dude, chillax. You may find this hard to believe but I don’t spend all day monitoring the site.

Here how about this: I may have confused you with another Columbus based poster. If I did I’m sorry. Anyway, is it a real big deal if you’re a OSU appologist?

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 22, 2008 7:53 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

You posted a comment below 8 minutes after I posted my comment. So I find it hard to believe that you didn’t read it. It has nothing to do with you monitering this site all day—neither do I.

Also, thanks for the apology. That’s all I wanted.

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 22, 2008 8:15 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

BTW, I was gonna ask you, how’d you end up in Dodd Hall?

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 22, 2008 8:15 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Last November, I got in a really, really bad car accident – as in, I’m lucky to be alive. I was driving home from school and a guy turning hit my car on the driver’s side. (Of course, he had no insurance.) I had about 15 broken bones and have gone through 11 surgeries since then (and I’ll probably have a couple more). I didn’t come home until April and had to go back to the hospital a couple more times since then.

I’m walking now pretty well with a cane or a walker, and doing therapy three times a week to keep improving. My range of motion on my left knee and right hip is still limited, my left elbow doesn’t bend, and my right foot doesn’t move at the ankle because of nerve damage in my leg.. My goal is to get back to teaching in September, although I’ll probably spend most of the day in a wheelchair because I have almost no edurance and get tired very quickly. I just want to get back to a normal life.

This is the reason that I wasn’t around this site pretty much the entire offseason. I missed opening day at the Jake with my wife for the first time in a few years. Thank you for asking, Chuck.

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 22, 2008 9:29 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Hey,best of luck. Sounds like you’ve got the right attiude, the docs can only do so much for you, the rest ya gotta do for yourself. Stay gritty, dude.

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 23, 2008 6:50 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Hello Brad,

Sorry to hear about the accident you were in – I hope everything keep improving for you. Stay strong!

The "cream of the crop" doesn't always rise to the top.

by indiansfan on Jul 27, 2008 7:32 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Nothing I like better than when LGT gets all meta and shit

by supermarioelia on Jul 22, 2008 8:06 PM EDT to parent up   2 recs

this is the post of the week

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 22, 2008 8:47 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Swift you coming to Canada anytime soon? You should join the entourage coming in August.

by supermarioelia on Jul 22, 2008 8:55 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

it’d only cost like, what, $8,000,000 to make it there with current gas prices (planes use gas too).

i wish i had money.

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 22, 2008 8:57 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Well let me know when you get rich and we’ll meet somewhere halfway.

Also, you’ll be proud of the fact I passed up Ted Nugent tickets for tomorrow night out of principle.

by supermarioelia on Jul 22, 2008 9:06 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

i’m afraid canada just got worse for allowing him in.

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 22, 2008 9:23 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Apparently this is his 5th straight year coming to my hometown. I’m guessing he doesn’t go to political on the crowd, otherwise he wouldn’t be welcome back.

by supermarioelia on Jul 22, 2008 10:03 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Hey Mario…since you posted here, I wanted to thank you for selling me your playoff tickets last year for the Yankees series. I haven’t had the chance to do that yet. That was the first playoff game I ever attended and it was fantastic! I’ll never forget that game and the atmosphere was great (even though we were the second row from the top – still awesome).

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 22, 2008 9:35 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

No problem, glad you had a good time. I’m just happy I got rid of the tickets without a loss.

by supermarioelia on Jul 22, 2008 10:03 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

But it seems like there is a double standard here among the members. If you’re a "regular", you can say whatever you want and get away with it from the other regulars. If you’re a guy, like me, who reads this site often and posts less frequently, you are bombarded by the members here for things you say that don’t agree with everybody here.

Hey, Brad. You’re right that there is a double-standard, but it isn’t regular vs. irregular. It’s just a double-standard for Chuck in particular. Chuck has just established himself as the crazy old guy, extremely knowledgeable about certain things, but also given to making totally crocked pronouncements that don’t make any sense. And he is basically the only person here — including me — from whom it is tolerated to say totally crazy-ass stuff without the slightest bit of real evidence or logic to back it up.

Of course, not everything he says is crazy, and like I said, he is quite knowledgeable in general.

It may also be the case that the regulars here can more easily tell when the other regulars are joking, or exaggerating for effect. So for example, I might say something outrageous, and you’re thinking, hey, I couldn’t get away with saying that — but the other regulars know that I’m kidding, because they know me.

Anyway … you’re getting pretty regular. Don’t sweat it, it’ll all make more sense as time goes on.

by Jay on Jul 22, 2008 11:45 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Hey, give me a little rhythm here. Given Buckeye Brad’s avatar you can see how I got confused. And again, when did being an OSU chauvinist become a crime?

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 23, 2008 7:03 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I was just offended that you implied that I was some sort of OSU apologist. I am a Buckeyes fan, of course, but that doesn’t mean that I blindly defend every OSU player.

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 23, 2008 9:19 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Also Chuck, you and I have had some arguments on this site before where you have said some crazy things and then tried to back them up when I called you on it. But I don’t think you’re a bad guy or anything….I’m sure I would enjoy sharing a beer with you if you’re ever in Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 23, 2008 11:28 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Chuck in Columbus? Heaven forfend that he deign to visit this town he has denigrated at every opportunity!

Free Andy Marte!

Pronk Needs You

by woodsmeister on Jul 23, 2008 1:33 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Usta live in Columbus – on Seibert and Mohawk for awhile and then UA offa Lane. In fact my kid’s in Columbus right now at the in-laws.

Ah Columbus, not exactly West Virginia – but you can smell the pig-shit and hear the banjos for there.

Resident LGT beer kinda sewer

by mauichuck on Jul 23, 2008 1:57 PM EDT to parent up   1 recs

Are you referring to the Columbus that is now almost two times the size of Cleveland? I know people used to think of Columbus as a “cow town”, but it’s far from that now.

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 24, 2008 9:16 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

/cancels plans to herd cattle down High St.

In all seriousness, though, Columbus’s population is larger, but geographically, its municipal boundaries include what would otherwise be quite a few suburbs. It’s like redrawing the map to put Shaker Heights, Lakewood, Brook Park, Cleveland Heights, and Parma into Cleveland.

In any event, Cleveland’s Nielsen designated market area is 17th, and Columbus’s is 32nd. I don’t think there’s much question that Cleveland’s the more populous metropolitan area.

by fleerdon on Jul 24, 2008 9:31 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Oh, I’m completely aware of that. My house in C-bus sits on land that 20 years ago was probably farmland (near the Polaris shopping area). That whole area has grown, but instead of becoming a suburb it’s been absorbed by the city of Columbus. Cleveland doesn’t have that luxury, as you’ve stated. And I know Cleveland’s metropolitan area is still quite larger.

My point was, though, that Columbus isn’t the small city that is used to be. All of central Ohio is growing while most of the rest of Ohio is losing population.

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 24, 2008 11:41 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Two times the size?

Well, there are two ways to answer this.

One is to pull out the Metropolitan Statistical Areas and start getting technical with population studies, market sizes, the reasons why Columbus annexed the hell out of central Ohio and Cleveland couldn’t, ec.

The other is just to point out the Columbus is a hellhole, almost totally lacking the cultural elements that make a big city great, and if it’s grown by leaps and bounds, then that just makes it an even bigger hellhole.

by Jay on Jul 24, 2008 3:00 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Well, your first point I already discussed above. Did you read that?

As to your second point, what is the reason for calling Columbus a “hellhole”? What has that city ever done to you? You sound like you have an agenda.

(By the way, in case it’s not clear, I’ve never said nor have I intended to say that Columbus is a “better” city than Cleveland. I was just responding to Chuck’s degrading remarks about the city. Why can’t people just discuss things without getting nasty about them?)

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 24, 2008 3:49 PM EDT to parent up   0