Tim Belcher named the new Indians pitching coach
by Buckeye Brad on Nov 5, 2009 6:34 PM EST
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PrintI don't have a link, but I have it from a reliable inside source that Tim Belcher has accepted the position as Indians pitching coach under Manny Acta. The team is supposed to have a press conference tonight to make the announcement. Belcher has served various roles in the Indians organization over the past few years, including spring training instructor and advanced scout. As far as I know, this will be his first job as a pitching coach. He's a former #1 overall draft choice who pitched for seven different teams from 1987-2000.
UPDATE: Cleveland.com is confirming the story. He has worked in the Indians organization for the past 8 years.
As a special assistant, Belcher worked with the Indians player development system in instructing and evaluating pitching talent at every level in the minor league system. He also scouted other teams, providing advance scouting reports for the last several years for the Tribe's big-league coaching staff.
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Why do I have it in my head that Belcher was something of a roving minor league pitching instructor for the Tribe?
His official title was “Special Assistant to Baseball Operations” for the Indians. As I said above, I know he worked with the team in spring training and did some scouting for them. He could very well have worked with the minor league teams throughout the season, but I’m not sure of that.
That would be awesome. Maybe he could make me Assistant to the Traveling Secretary.
by Buckeye Brad on Nov 6, 2009 12:39 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks, BB, but you need to do a better job of protecting your sources, or they’re going to dry up. Just sayin’.
by ken from alexandria on Nov 5, 2009 8:54 PM EST reply actions
I thought it was odd that they’d announce it at night anyways, so I’m guessing it will be tomorrow.
by Buckeye Brad on Nov 5, 2009 10:20 PM EST up reply actions
I was kinda hoping Radinsky would get it – the young pitchers seem to really like working with him. But, there’ll be a lot of up and comers on the Columbus roster to work with, so mebbe they figured that’s where he would benefit the org the most.
For now, at least.
Did Farrell or Bud Black have any coaching experience before taking their ML pitching coach positions? I can’t really find much on them managing at any level in the minors but both could be considered successful pitching coaches if that is the case.
I’m just surprised they did it this year, in this situation.
by Jay on Nov 6, 2009 9:43 PM EST up reply actions
Teehee. In 15 years of seriously watching baseball, I still can’t think of Tim Belcher’s name without chuckling.
"You are an LGT success story" -- Jay
Teeheheheheheheeee
"You are an LGT success story" -- Jay
by Turkmenbashi on Nov 6, 2009 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
The Indians tweet a confirmation. Nothing on the official site or from Castro and the gang yet.
Steel Nick
I must admit, I start to roll my eyes when a top qualification noted for a Tribe hire is that “he knows the organization inside and out”.
It’s like saying “He knows every restaurant in Mansfield, Ohio.”
by odradek on Nov 7, 2009 8:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
What’s curious is the importance Shapiro placed on any potential manager having a clear idea for the pitching coach he wanted to hire. I don’t know where Acta and Belcher would have crossed paths.
Steel Nick
is this really that bad a pick? seems like, at this point, it’s at least worthy of a “meh.”
Before taking Pro-Acta, please consult your doctor. Do not taunt Pro-Acta.
I was expecting a meh. Leo Mazzone would have been pretty dang exciting, but I wasn’t expecting that.
by Wil Cantrell on Nov 6, 2009 12:30 PM EST up reply actions
given the surprising nature of this name, I’ll call your “bah” and counter-raise you a “huh?” but given that it’s a “huh?” i’m not prepared to say “grrrrr”
Before taking Pro-Acta, please consult your doctor. Do not taunt Pro-Acta.
I’ll see your monocultural “Bah!” and “grrrr” and raise you a “Mangini!”
by APV on Nov 6, 2009 2:04 PM EST up reply actions
Belcher may end up being a fantastic pitching coach, but if your organization has had problems developing pitchers in the past couple years, shouldn’t that discourage you from hiring a guy whose job it was to develop pitching in the minors? Why not go after a minor-league instructor from a system that’s had success developing pitchers?
which begs the question: why, then, did everyone seem ok with Radinksy?
Before taking Pro-Acta, please consult your doctor. Do not taunt Pro-Acta.
Not everyone. There just wasn’t much point raising un-enthusiasm when there wasn’t much reason to think he was a serious candidate.
by Jay on Nov 6, 2009 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
One perspective is that, excepting injury, we have done a good job of developing minor league pitchers. We have lots of good minor league pitchers. We have had less success at translating that minor league success to the majors. I don’t know how different those two issues are.
by APV on Nov 6, 2009 2:05 PM EST up reply actions
I love how the VERY FIRST COMMENT on cleveland.com totally goes nuclear with the standard tropes. “Nailed it.”
saw that. my eyes are burning. I told my mom I read cleveland.com comments today and she grounded me. I’m 33.
Before taking Pro-Acta, please consult your doctor. Do not taunt Pro-Acta.
by Ockus_NYC on Nov 6, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I like when they start the sophomoric humor about his last name and somebody says we hired Dale Farter as our hitting coach. I almost laughed, then I remembered that I’m not 8 years old.
My favorites are the supposed voices of reason who make completely empty arguments in defending the pick: “He’s an Ohio guy…”
So, then, if Mazzone was from Pittsburgh…..
Before taking Pro-Acta, please consult your doctor. Do not taunt Pro-Acta.
Mark my words: someone will use this to segue into a Dolan is Cheap rant in the Belcher thread on cleveland.com.
Before taking Pro-Acta, please consult your doctor. Do not taunt Pro-Acta.
hmm
I dont know how or what to feel about this pick. I kind of wanted a guy from maybe the Giants system or even the Athletics. I dont pay much attention to go into detail but the Giants developed one hell of a staff with Lincecum and Cain. The Athletics have always produced good pitchers from Hudson to Harden.
The Athletics have always produced good pitchers from Hudson to Harden
If you like this logic why not keep Willis? After all he “produced” two Cy Young winners.
Resident LGT results-oriented boob.
I have sense Harden and Hudson were good pitchers before they were A’s. Perhaps they got better as a result, but they seemed like “can’t miss” types coming up. Same with Lincecum and Cain.
Wait 'til next millennium!
Lots of guys seem like they’re “can’t miss.” The A’s didn’t miss.
by Jay on Nov 6, 2009 2:21 PM EST up reply actions
So I guess we can hang the Adam Miller fiasco on Willis? Yeah, the way things have been going, why not?
Resident LGT results-oriented boob.
I don’t know if there’s anyone to blame, but surely there’s nobody to credit.
by Jay on Nov 6, 2009 2:34 PM EST up reply actions
Adam Miller
OK, I’m lost.
The once and future
by Manhattan Tribe Fan on Nov 6, 2009 7:30 PM EST up reply actions
Thats exactly what i mean
The A’s dont miss the cant miss guys. When we’re drafting pitchers at the likes of Jeremy Sowers in the first round with our top pick then something is wrong. Not only do they not miss on these guys but they do a heck of a good job developing them.
Why didn’t we think of this prior to this very moment? Wail and repent, for the salvation of the Indians is at hand.
(just because somebody is required to say it)
Can’t-miss pitchers are the new market inefficiency!
by Jay on Nov 8, 2009 9:51 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Crap! I was hoping for Leo Mazzone. It’s that tightwad Dolan again, idinit?
Resident LGT results-oriented boob.
OK, they should never have reversed the buttons. I almost flagged Tim the Enchanter.
The once and future
by Manhattan Tribe Fan on Nov 6, 2009 7:31 PM EST up reply actions
He also scouted other teams, providing advance scouting reports for the last several years
glad someone else will be doing this now. i’ve been saying for months the biggest problem with the recent team was advance scouting. i’m at least a teeny bit serious.
This is from Mark Shapiro, my emphasis added:
Chris and I all reaching out to people in the industry that we have good relationships with and trust to determine who we thought could be difference making pitching coaches.
by APV on Nov 6, 2009 9:36 PM EST up reply actions
Probably the same reason it makes me uneasy. The Indians front office are all made of smart guys, but they all know they are smart guys…despite managing a very unsuccessful roster. I’d like to hear that they are seeking as many outside voices as possible.
by APV on Nov 6, 2009 9:51 PM EST up reply actions
Acta suggests (and Hoynes reports) that a lot of teams have wanted Belcher as a pitching coach over the last few years, but he hadn’t been willing to commit the time away from his family before now. I don’t know if he felt the time was right now, or if the fact that he’ll be based in Cleveland is what made the difference.
This is consistent with the fact that he was a major leaguer throughout the 90’s, which means that, unlike prior generations of players, Belcher is already a multi-millionaire. He doesn’t need a job, and he isn’t going to take a full-time position unless he really wants one.
by Jay on Nov 6, 2009 9:59 PM EST up reply actions
I have no problem with hiring Belcher – he sounds fine. I just have become tuned in to comments from Shapiro that reinforce the impression that he thinks he is really smart. I should say, I think Shapiro is smart…but people who think they are smart can smart themselves into corners.
by APV on Nov 6, 2009 10:06 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I cannot for the life of me understand why Shapiro wouldn’t be questioning his “method” by now. How can you rationalize going from a WS contender to the bottom 10% of Major League Baseball in only two years and still think you’re “smart” about the game?
My best case scenario would be Shapiro bringing in a guy like Mazzone to at least evaluate or instruct. Maybe see if Peters has the energy to help him with the scouting/drafting – but something, anything but the same approach looking for better results.
It all maybe moot anyway. I believe that if Dolan doesn’t see some real improvement next year – a low possibility in my opinion – Shapiro’ll be headed to join Wedge in the 2010 off-season.
Resident LGT results-oriented boob.
How can you rationalize going from a WS contender to the bottom 10% of Major League Baseball in only two years and still think you’re "smart" about the game?
Because you know the saying, you’re never as good … and never as bad … etc.
Probably makes more sense to look at it in terms of a rolling average.
You maybe right. My model is three-four years of awfulness – while the kids mature – followed by 1-2 years of contention – followed by one WS Championship, blow it all up – cuz we won’t have the cash to sign the guys who got us to the WS – and start all over again. So it’s last place, last place, fourth, third, play-offs (first round loss), play-offs (second round loss), WS Championship, rinse, repeat. Over the course of the cycle we’re a little above average.
What I don’t want is third, third, third, third on infinitum.
Same average, but in my scenario we at least end up with a championship.
Resident LGT results-oriented boob.
This should be a bright shade of green.
by supermarioelia on Nov 6, 2009 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I’m pretty sure that Belcher wouldn’t have taken this job anywhere but in Cleveland (or maybe Cincinnati). I don’t know if other teams have offered him a job, but I know that he hasn’t wanted to be away from his family for a full season. He was obviously away from home a lot during his playing career and I know he enjoyed being around his family more over the past 9 years. He still lives in the area where he grew up and his kids go to school right down the road from his house. But Cleveland is only about 2 hours away so he can still go home on off days during the season.
My guess is that he’s stayed in the Indians organization waiting for this job to open up. Maybe Shapiro even told him that he’d be a candidate the next time the team was looking for a new pitching coach so he decided to wait for his opportunity.
by Buckeye Brad on Nov 7, 2009 12:23 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t like this. I hoped that the Acta hire would expand that circle. So it wasn’t just guys that Antonetti and Shapiro had a good and trusting relationship. I hoped that guys Acta trusted would be considered, maybe guys that Antonetti and Shapiro didn’t know or wouldn’t have otherwise considered.
Hopefully that is the case with the rest of the hires. But as this was the most important of those non-Manager positions, I’m a little disappointed.
reply FAIL. this belongs way up the chain. i screwed up. damned scotch.
Before taking Pro-Acta, please consult your doctor. Do not taunt Pro-Acta.
by Ockus_NYC on Nov 6, 2009 10:28 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
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