Game 46: Indians 11, Rays 10
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 10:17 PM EDT
in Game Recaps
213 comments
There is no point in searching for moral victories in Fausto Carmona's starts at this point; either Fausto is going to correct his control issues or he's going to be a pitcher sporting a 6+ ERA. It doesn't matter if some games he gets more groundballs or seems more composed or whatever. He has to stop walking people, period. After his abysmal start today, Carmona has a 35:33 K:BB ratio; in only three of his ten starts has Carmona struck out more than he's walked. No amount of double play balls is going to fix Fausto and, frankly, if this weren't a season in which the Indians had already lost three starters to the DL, a trip to Columbus might be in order (someone want to enlighten us on options status?).
By the time Fausto and Jensen Lewis had closed their books, the Indians were down 10-0 and the game was basically over. But, a funny thing happened on the way to the forum and the Indians had cut the margin to 10-4 by the bottom of the ninth; still unsurmountable but at least not a shutout. Then, well, then this:
Grady Sizemore walks. None out.
Victor Martinez pops out to third basemen Evan Longoria. One out.
Jhonny Peralta singles on a soft line drive to left fielder Carl Crawford. Grady Sizemore to 2nd. One out.
Shin-Soo Choo reaches on force attempt. Fielding error by shortstop Reid Brignac. Jhonny Peralta to 3rd. Shin-Soo Choo to 2nd.
Mark DeRosa lines out to third baseman Evan Longoria. Two out.
Ryan Garko homers on a line drive to left field. Jhonny Peralta scores. Shin-Soo Choo scores. Two out.
Asdrubal Cabrera walks. Two out.
Ben Francisco walks. Asdrubal Cabrera to 2nd. Two out.
Jamey Carroll walks. Asdrubal Cabrera to 3rd. Ben Francisco to 2nd. Two out.
Grady Sizemore walks. Asdrubal Cabrera scores. Ben Francisco to 3rd. Jamey Carroll to 2nd. Two out.
Victor Martinez singles on a groundball to center fielder B.J. Upton. Ben Francisco scores. Jamey Carroll scores. Grady Sizemore to 2nd. Two out.
Indians 11, Rays 10. And that, ladies and gentlemen, is how you get Jeremy Sowers a major league win.
In all seriousness, a night after taking an extra-innings loss it was an emphatic response from an oft-maligned offense. The Indians offense is good, or at least significantly better than league average, and that's one bright spot in a dark season.
So, obviously, a very exciting win and one well worth re-watching on your DVR. I don't mean to undersell this incredible comeback but I can't help but wish that this could've happened on a day in which we were not sending two starters to the DL. I'd love to think of this as an important win in the context of the season, and if it is one I'll be thrilled, but future expectations shouldn't be shaped by some concept of an 'emotional turning point.' With Carmona's dismal performance and the transactions of the day, this Indians' pitching staff is no longer the one which we all envisioned being part of a playoff push and as the staff loses it's war of attrition against the rest of the league, Cleveland becomes a shell of it's projected self.
But, hey, baseball is supposed to be entertaining and this game was certainly that. At the very least, the Tribe was great today.
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that fangraph looks like the complete inverse of that depressing one from a week ago or so (really, the games all blend into each other at this point). Was it the Wood blown save @ KC?
You know Selig? Ombudsman.
by rolub on May 25, 2009 10:22 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I don’t want to alarm anyone but Casey Blake has a .953 OPS and a .398 wOBA….
Now THAT’S depressing
by world dictator on May 26, 2009 2:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yea, but that’s almost entirely due to this incredible 3 week tear he has been on. Check out his stats at the beginning of May, he was benched a few days because he was slumping so badly.
It’s similar to his May tear that he had in 2007 that kept Agent M off the field for the rest of the year.
by Toxicadam on May 26, 2009 8:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I mentioned this in another thread but has anyone considered a DeRosa-Penny trade? (Perhaps with a third team if necessary)
At this point, I think SP is almost as much of a concern as the bullpen. My only hesitation is Penny’s 4.98 FIP.
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 10:31 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think Penny is anything close to what the Indians need. They need a player that can potentiall impact ’10.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well I figure that if the Indians “drop out of contention” this year we could always flip Penny before the trade deadline.
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I just don’t think the Indians have any business picking up a retread with bleh peripherals and results. If we didn’t have Pavano right now, would we be trading for Pavano?
Of course not. We’re thinking about trading Pavano right now.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we didn’t have Pavano right now, would we be trading for Pavano?
I think so. Pavano seems like the type of pitcher some GM’s would underrate, with his high ERA and decent FIP.
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And to be fair, we’re looking at trading Pavano if we throw in the towel for 2009. Sure, a lot of us around here might have done that, but every sign I see says Shapiro is still looking to compete this year.
So like I said, I think Penny is worth a shot if we can get him for a decent price.(A big IF i know).
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, the disconnect for me: if the Indians are going to contend in 2009 it’s going to be because of a miracle, not because we acquired Brad Penny. So, lets wait for a miracle for a couple of weeks and then start the sale. I see no real point in dealing useful parts that could turn into young players (DeRo) into vets to “right the ship.”
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
All indications were that DeRosa was being shopped for a young bullpen arm …
If you believe the writers … any deal will have to be even financially … might be troublesome with “veterans.”
by FallsTribeFan on May 25, 2009 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Like I said, the way you, and others feel, and the way Shapiro feels aren’t necessarily the same. I don’t disagree with you per se, I’m just operating from the POV that Shapiro still wants to compete this year.
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we’re trying to represent Shap’s viewpoint, I’m going to wager that we need to totally rule out veteran starting pitching on one year deals. I don’t think Penny is nearly as fungible as you think; frankly, I don’t see much in his performance to make me think he’s got DeRosa’s value to a contender at the deadline.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and like you said….acquiring Penny doesn’t all of a sudden change any sort of expectation about the team’s chances of making the playoffs
by Roger Dorn on May 25, 2009 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Trading for a veteran on a one year deals seems like exactly the kind of move Shaprio would make. No long term financial commitment, low risk. The Kenny Lofton trade springs to mind.
Though after looking at the numbers I’d agree that DeRosa should be worth more than Penny
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 10:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We were in first place when we acquired Lofton. Way different situation
by Roger Dorn on May 25, 2009 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why?
I know that there was a difference in standings, but I see no evidence that it changes Shapiro’s stance on trading for veterans with one year deals. If we were talking about trading for Matt Holiday which would require a lot of important prospects, sure you might have a point. But we’re not are we?
Is there any evidence Shapiro categorical refuses to deal for veterans with expiring contracts?
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 11:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shapiro plays the numbers and, no matter what his heart says, he’s not going to throw away a trading chip at a less than 5% chance of making the playoffs. He’s going to use it to buy something for the future.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right. In addition, I can promise that Kenny Lofton would not have been an Indian that year if we were in last place with only a very small hope of making the playoffs
by Roger Dorn on May 25, 2009 11:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Max Ramirez is a decent counter point to the “Shapiro won’t trade prospects” trope.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder if we’d have targeted Santana if Max was still in the system. If we had both those guys, we’d have the craziest catching depth of all time
by Roger Dorn on May 25, 2009 11:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right you said that before. Now do you have any proof besides you don’t want to?
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is bizarre. Contending teams trade for pending free agents. Non-contending teams trade pending free agents for prospects from contending teams. The Indians are not a contending team until they show otherwise, and we’ll know in a matter of weeks.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, teams who think they can contend trade for pending free agents.
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Teams who think they can contend, and have good reason to do so, and would not be jeopardizing their future, and who have ample payroll space, trade for pending free agents.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Again we’re all assuming that any trade for Penny/impending veteran free agent is going to require some critical piece to our future.
Even in our current situation, I wouldn’t call the players we trade for DeRosa this off season critical to our future
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
WD, you’re just wrong here. If you’re OUT OF IT, you don’t trade FOR veterans. I mean… what?
by gte619n on May 26, 2009 8:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Welcome to the conversation, 15 comments too late.
Not trying to be a jerk here, but yes I get the argument about not trading for veterans if you’re out of contention. But what my argument was and has always been is, the most recent indications point to Shapiro believing we can still make a competitive run.
Maybe you think he’s wrong, maybe you think he’s changed his mind, maybe you think trading for veterans on one year contracts isn’t his style. That’s fine. Those are all conservations we can have.
But saying “you don’t trade for veterans if you’re out of contentionz” is completely non responsive to the point I originally made
by world dictator on May 26, 2009 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right. But like I said, I’m not approaching this from fanboy “we’re just 7.5 games back…what if we get hot!”
i’m saying if Shapiro is looking to compete this year, like writers have alleged, Penny should be an option if Boston isn’t asking too much.
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think it’s simply incorrect to think Shapiro looks at this as a team competitive enough to add rentals. That’s not Shapiro, in my opinion.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
me too, but if we win like 4 of our next 5…
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
or 5 of our next 5…right…right?
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 10:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think we need to go on a 10-2 streak or something thereabouts. Between poor play and injuries, this team is on life support right now.
by APV on May 25, 2009 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We’ll be something like 5 to 7 games out, and we still won’t have any pitchers.
This has a lot more to do with Innings Pitched than it does with Games Behind at this point.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Absolutely right. Someone has to pitch innings. Reyes is probably gone for the year, Laffey for a couple of months, Westbrook for a couple months. Fausto is a mess. That leaves Lee and Pavano, and pray for rain.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think we’ll find a third guy from Sowers, Ohka, Saarlos, and other dregs. Lots of lousy pitches put together 15 good starts every season.
Hell, sign Paul Byrd.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we had the money I’d sign Byrd or Pedro. Hopefully if we play our cards right flipping derosa will be one aspect of a two part move.
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ahem
/points to ridiculously oversize Zach Jackson fan club t-shirt (worn)
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So far, the Tribe has had every preseason rotation question mark turn up negative, with the important exception of Pavano. Sowers has sucked, Fausto has sucked, Reyes was fragile (as feared), Huff hasn’t shined in three innings, Jackson, Lewis, etc. There was supposed to be quantity to cover for suspicious quality, but I see no reason to expect quality starts from Ohka or Saarlos.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think anyone expects quality. Just some arms to get us through the season
by Roger Dorn on May 25, 2009 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because, to mimic Jay, the dice have no memory.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But the dice are more likely to come up six or seven than two or twelve.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The trick, you said, is never play the game too long
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I mean, right now, I start acting like the season’s over. The question is, how much do we need to add for 2010 (or, realistically, 2011), and what are we prepared to pay for it? If the team climbs back into it, well, super, but that’s Wedge’s gig at this point.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
disagree disagree disagree
I still say there’s little to be gained by quitting now as opposed to a month from now. Aren’t you all just saying that because you don’t want the pain to drag out? That’s silly.
The dispositive quit move, as of today, would be trading Pavano right now. C’mon – let’s play just a little bit longer.
by dgcambridge on May 25, 2009 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The problem is payroll is probably becoming an issue. There’s not much to be gained from a trade perspective right now relative to a month from now – but something tells me there is some pressure to unload a little salary. We were already projected to go over-budget this season, and that was with projections of a successful season and decent attendance. Don’t see that happening now.
by APV on May 25, 2009 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fair enough. I do trade DeRosa at this point for just about anything, because he is unnecessary. But there’s no hope without Pavano (and yeah I know someone is going to say theres no hope with Pavano).
by dgcambridge on May 25, 2009 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’ll be interesting to see what happens with those two. I suppose chances are best that neither of them will be around past the trading deadline. I admit to being almost entirely wrong in my skepticism towards Pavano so far.
by APV on May 25, 2009 11:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We have what…$12 million coming off the books this season? The possibilities…
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t mean, trade him tomorrow. But I open the bidding pretty soon.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think they’re on the verge of this conclusion. But so far, in 46 games, there hasn’t been a positive sign. The 2009 season has been pretty much suck for the Indians. Maybe you wait as long as you can to see if the team can win three in a row. Decision time is nigh, but it might be proper to wait and see if the team responds well to some positive development (i.e., Sowers’ five-inning stint tonight).
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agree, and disagree.
I see the most likely scenario being Shapiro getting the best possible talent he can. If that’s the arms we want for next year, great; if not, then he’s creating depth from which to deal. Seems unlikely to me that a contending team would move high-level pitching depth before a playoff race.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There’s always someone willing to deal something Cleveland wants. They got high level pitching (MeLoan) and a top 10 prospect off of a playoff team last year. That’s obviously a ‘raising the bar’ deal but someone will give something up if the right players get injured.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, I’m licking my chops. Pavano’s a great chip; DeRosa too.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d say, at this point, starting pitching is way more of a concern than the bullpen.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Especially if we keep Sowers out there and he keeps pitching like that. I wouldn’t take Penny for DeRo, though.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder what it would take to get Cain. Probably a bit more than we’re comfortable with, but he’s under team control for two more years.
Though a 2.40 ERA and a 4.33 FIP is ummm…concerning?
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Acquiring a SP who will be a free agent after this season doesn’t make a whole lot of sense. While we shouldn’t throw in the towel yet, we also should not be making trades that are only focused on contending this year as far back as we are
by Roger Dorn on May 25, 2009 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Trading for quality SP that will be under team control next year is easier said than done. Especially when you take into account we’d have to trade pretty decent prospects to acquire the player. But hey, for the right trade I’m all for it. I just don’t think we should rule out relatively cheap upgrades for this year that can be flipped again should the need arise.
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If I’m calculating correctly, Carmona is out of options.
Added to the roster in November, 2004.
Optioned out in ST of 2005 and 2006 … then was sent down during the Lee/Westbrook injury thing in 2007.
Now, my question on 2007 … is whether they were able to “revoke” his option due to the injury.
If that’s the case … he may have one left.
by FallsTribeFan on May 25, 2009 10:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Maybe we can get him to “ask” to go down like Contreras
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I they say DL him for “strike zone anxiety disorder.”
by FallsTribeFan on May 25, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don’t they call that Ankiel Syndrome nowadays?
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Until Steve Blass sues for custody.
by FallsTribeFan on May 25, 2009 10:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just remembered that I had a pdf of half of the 2008 media guide and here’s what I can show
you from it:
Carmona:
ML Service: 1 + 169
Contract Status: Signed thru 2008
Acquired: December 28, 2000; Signed as a non-drafted free agent by
the Cleveland Indians.
As opposed to a guy with options:
ML Service: 0 + 055
Contract Status (Options remaining): Signed thru 2008 (3)
Acquired: June 30, 2006; Acquired from the Seattle Mariners in
exchange for 1B Eduardo Perez.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 26, 2009 12:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i’m not sure how to interpret that, but as falls tribe fan says, he was optioned in ’05 and ’06 out of spring training, was sent down on May 1, 2007, but was recalled on May 7, 2007 (i.e. within 20 days) so did not burn an option that year.
or so far as i know. swerbs thinks i’m right, and they’re pretty accurate on this stuff.
by emil minty on May 26, 2009 8:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So, in other words, the injury allowed the Indians to “revoke” the option …
by FallsTribeFan on May 26, 2009 9:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
so far as i know, the rule is not injury-dependant. the player has to be off the 25-man and playing in the minors for 20 days (total, over the course of the season in question) for it to count as an optional assignment.
by emil minty on May 26, 2009 9:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think what FallsTribeFran is referring to is the speed with which Carmona was recalled. Normally a player would have to spend 10 days in the minors at a minimum, except in cases where exceptional injury circumstances at the big league level necessitate an immediate return.
by APV on May 26, 2009 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was my point … but I did not know about the 20-day rule for options.
So, if a player is optioned out … he must stay down for 10 days … but if he’s down for 10 more … the option sticks?
That’s interesting …
My assumption was that teams were able to revoke an “option” if injury necessitated the recall of said player.
That said … the long and short seems to be he has an option left.
Bigger problem is that there is no one to step into the breach.
by FallsTribeFan on May 26, 2009 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
An injury enables you to bypass the waiting period, but that is separate action from the “option”.
by jhon on May 26, 2009 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think it was Manning who said tonight that other teams simply aren’t swinging at Fausto’s pitches. They swung at four of 24 pitches in the second? There won’t be a return of 2007 Carmona if he can’t get ahead of counts. Maybe in 2007 hitters didn’t know enough to lay off. If this is the adjustment the league has made to Carmona, then he hasn’t been able to adjust back. He looks bad when he’s laying the pitches over for strikes, and he is significantly diminished when he pitches from the stretch.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 10:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Fausto needs a work vacation at Columbus. There’s no point in putting him out there right now. Even when he has stretches of getting in a groove, he has no idea why. I’m no pitching coach, but even as a fan I can watch and tell when he amps up and starts losing control.
by mcrose on May 25, 2009 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think it’s key that he gets ahead in the count. He’s so tough to square up that hitters narrow their vision when ahead in the count even more against Fausto. They’re more apt to swing at the 0-1 pitch than they are the 1-0 pitch.
by TribeJay on May 26, 2009 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d love to think of this as an important win in the context of the season, and if it is one I’ll be thrilled, but future expectations shouldn’t be shaped by some concept of an ‘emotional turning point.’ With Carmona’s dismal performance and the transactions of the day, this Indians’ pitching staff is no longer the one which we all envisioned being part of a playoff push and, as the staff loses it’s war of attrition against the rest of the league, Cleveland becomes a shell of it’s projected self.
Well it’s certainly emotional, you could tell that by the pile of players at the end. Whether its a turning point remains to be seen, but its safe to say they’re not worried about pre-season expectations any more.
by mcrose on May 25, 2009 10:42 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think parsing the phrase “emotional turning point” is fair. It has to be a turning point and be emotional, and preferably some kind of causation exists.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No causation without representation.
"I gotta be honest, I dunno much about the climate in Japan." - Matt Underwood
by USSChoo on May 25, 2009 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You parse what you pick. I was just saying the time is long gone where this season had anything to do with March expectations.
But as for causation, it certainly precedes effect. You’d think someone would start playing better after they stopped worrying about it.
by mcrose on May 25, 2009 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was just saying the time is long gone where this season had anything to do with March expectations.
Who says? If the Indians roll off 10 wins right now, you don’t think you’ll be getting soundbites about finally putting expectations away on May 25?
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think you’re misunderestimating. When Laffey and Reyes went out the other night, I thought to myself, "Damn, now they have to start playing "
I don’t know about you, but I think this team can play a LOT better than it has so far.To me it seems the sooner it becomes totally obvious that this season isn’t turning out as planned, the better.
by mcrose on May 25, 2009 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ll admit it, I gave up on this one at 10-2. Great win for us.
I become an expert simply by doing something.
by fwembt on May 25, 2009 10:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
You lasted longer than I did. I stopped watching at 3-0.
by supermarioelia on May 25, 2009 10:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
5-0.
Case of the beet bandit. Missing beets from all over the farm, no footprints. Inside job. Mose in socks. Boom. Case closed. -Dwight Schrute
by mjschaefer on May 26, 2009 1:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I stopped at 10-2 and then we failed to cash in with bases loaded and 1 out. I figured if it was going to happen, it would have happened there.
by Toxicadam on May 26, 2009 5:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I checked the score right before hopping on a plane and we were down 10-2. Checked again when I got off and we’d won. Now that’s a good flight.
"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter
by Denver Tribe Fan on May 26, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well. This is a nice surprise.
I thought that perhaps Andrew was having fun with headlines. Then I realized he was dead serious.
Going back to DVR now, thanks.
And you know what? WOOOO HOOOOO! We can do that at least once in a while, right? Why stop believing?
by tabler84 on May 25, 2009 10:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It’s games like this that just tantalize into more nights spent crawling into a bottle. And yet, we all show up each day, expecting something sublime. I love/hate baseball.
I become an expert simply by doing something.
by fwembt on May 25, 2009 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just got home from the gym, saw the score there at 7-0 and checked here just to see how bad it got. Now I have to wait for my roommate to finish Wall-E to watch it.
Il faut d'abord durer.
by CU Adam on May 25, 2009 10:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
THIS is the game I didn’t watch?
Shame on me.
by xrickx on May 25, 2009 10:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
So, watching the replay of the 9th inning: Asdrubal as a mohawk?
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I first spotted it in Round 1 of Tribe vs. Rays. One and a half thumbs up; he’ll get both thumbs if he can confirm that he does not, in fact, gel it. Because it looks pretty darn gelled.
by Fire Slider on May 26, 2009 3:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i despise how much of the 80’s is coming back
by Brick. on May 26, 2009 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My line of demarcation is the Members Only jacket. Once that comes back, I am leaving the country.
by Toxicadam on May 26, 2009 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tries to act like he doesn’t wear a Members Only jacket occassionally.
by afh4 on May 26, 2009 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn’t try to act like he doesn’t wear said jacket.
by still ill on May 26, 2009 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ervin Santana did his best to help us out.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 11:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
This was unexpected. It looks like the fangraphs chart is (begrudingly) smiling.
by APV on May 25, 2009 11:16 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The fan graph is upside dowNO WAIT ITS NOT
I just rewatched the 9th on DVR. Fun stuff.
Yeah, I know our staff sucks blah blah blah. That was incredible!
My question is, can we keep the standings close enough to take a shot with Westbrook and an Akron arm or two in the second half? Yeah, it will be a struggle to get there, and we’ll need help, and even if we do, the odds are not in our favor of winning, but it’s no different than getting the tying run to the plate tonight.
Tupelo Prince!
by dgcambridge on May 25, 2009 11:20 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Here’s my thing: We don’t need one missing piece. We need three starters — now — and at least two effective relievers — now. Even if Westbrook pulls a best-case scenario, this team will have to push .600 for the rest of the season. I don’t think you’re going to put together a prolonged win streak like that with three starters and a reliever or two, which is all we have right now.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think it’s possible, in a way, to agree with both of you. I certainly agree that we need a lot, right now, to not fall completely out of contention. But I also think we don’t actually have to make the decision that the season is over till mid-June at the earliest. So in the meantime, we probably just have to hope for a miraculous turnaround with the guys we have right now. If that doesn’t happen, well, then we can consider our options.
by APV on May 25, 2009 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree. Another two or even three weeks, and hope for the best. Maybe the offense revives a little and scores more runs at home. Maybe the Tribe wins a few 9-7 games.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Again, I’m not saying people get shipped out tomorrow morning. Just that the burden is on the 25-man roster to figure things out for itself, and that the clock is ticking.
I’ll add to it: Nobody else thinks we’ve got serious problems in 2010? It’s like an entire generation of our pitching depth has flippin’ evaporated.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah I’m not optimistic for the future.
by supermarioelia on May 25, 2009 11:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I do – but not as big as the problems we have right now.
by APV on May 25, 2009 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
“Waves of arms…as far as the eye can see!”
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But, no, not as much as this year. Presuming you can count on Lee and Fausto, and presuming Jake comes back, you have three pretty good starters, and maybe Huff or Rondon by then. That’s more than the Tribe has this season.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Presuming you can count on … Fausto
That’s a huge presumption.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 11:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, I realize that. But Fausto was great in 2007. I have to believe the guy will somehow find a way to pitch rather than throw. Maybe he is a fourth or fifth starter rather than the one or two we hoped for. But he should be able to be a league-average pitcher with his stuff.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please… somebody… tell me we do not have Daniel Cabrera Redux.
by gte619n on May 26, 2009 8:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was actually considering this exact comparison last night.
by afh4 on May 26, 2009 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve been thinking this for a few days as well.
I really believe a lot of Fausto’s problems are between the ears.
by FallsTribeFan on May 26, 2009 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think its more mechanical as opposed to psychological although the psychological impact of sucking isn’t helping. His release point is later than it was in his 2007 season, which is a potential result of picking up bad habits in his injury riddled 2008 season that have not (for whatever reason) been addressed by the team’s coaching staff. He’s otherwise the same pitcher, velocity isn’t much different and the sinking action is still there (his HR/FB rate is good), but the horizontal movement on his pitches is too much due to the change in release point.
by hans on May 26, 2009 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
People are sort of quibbling but I think everyone is on the same page: wait and see if the Indians win the next 8 of 10 and, if they do, stand pat for a little while longer, if they don’t, start fielding offers.
We’re arriving at that from different perspectives but is there anyone who doesn’t agree? I don’t see anyone saying “Trade them NOW!” nor do I see anyone saying “NEVER TRADE THEM!”
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep. This is going to be a tough homestand, but the Indians seem to play the Rays and the Yankees better than they do the Reds. And I don’t think they even have to win eight of ten. They just have to play well.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
6-4 isn’t going to do much for us. 8 of 10 might be necessary.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They don’t have to make it up in one week. They can go 6-4 and show signs of life—that would be sufficient to keep things on the table.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
HOW ABOUT ONE OF THOSE EVER-ELUSIVE 3-GAME WIN STREAKS
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We actually had this debate last year about the optimal time to trade CC. And that was with us clearly out and a huge trading chip. (yes, huge) Some people (i.e. Sheehan) still thought we pulled the trigger too early. They were wrong, sure but still, that was July 7.
by dgcambridge on May 25, 2009 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think anyone would be really upset if we dealt some guys on June 15 at 15 games out nor if we dealt them on July 10 15 games out.
If there’s anything we can all agree on, it’s that Shapiro will handle this particular part of his job just fine.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
exactly. We’re not even within 10 days of June 7.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And the Tribe hasn’t played well yet this season. Even bad teams (excepting the Nationals) play well at some point.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Meaning I wouldn’t throw in the towel just yet because this team has done nothing but play poorly. Let’s wait and see what happens when they get on a little run.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly, am I saying, start making these moves as soon as possible, and throw in the towel?
YES I AM. PUT SOME COFFEE ON AND FIND MY MOBILE PHONE CHARGER.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Have we consider that Shapiro actually does things to precipitate these failures so he can show off his trading abilities?
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes. Right now he’s at the mirror, whistling a tune while shaving. He’s in pimp mode.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The don is upstairs moving furniture around at two in the morning.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, the 2010 answers to our pitching holes are not on our 25 man roster, outside of Huff. There’s some rebuilding to be done. Your assessment that we need 3 starters and 2 relievers now is not too off for 2010 also. We can fix it, but it will take some work by Shapiro, and those Akron guys.
by dgcambridge on May 25, 2009 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We don’t need 3 starters for 2010. We get to start with Cliff, Fausto, and Laffey, plus SLew, Huff, and Jake.
So, the depth sort of returns.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d still like to acquire one more “reliable” arm. Cliche I know, but a solid #3 starter would be nice. Sort of like a not downward trending Matt Cain
by world dictator on May 25, 2009 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t ever consider prospects reliable starters. Even in their best light, rookies have often painful growning pains. Minus a few exceptions at least.
I’m thinking more along the lines of a Dave Burba. Not spectacular but usually consistent.
by world dictator on May 26, 2009 12:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Actually, you know who would be a good fit as our consistent “Dave Burba” type? Odalis Perez.
Eric Seidman from Fangraphs has made the point that Perez has been amazingly consistent for the last four years posting win values of +1.6, +1.4, +1.5, +1.5. and a career FIP of 4.21 (4.62 last year)
I wouldn’t be surprised if we could buy low on Perez with a 2-year deal or at least a one year deal/with option .
by world dictator on May 26, 2009 1:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Perez is under contract until 2011 and receives $12 million each of the next two years. The Mets just signed him this offseason.
by hans on May 26, 2009 2:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You’re thinking of Oliver Perez
I’m talking about Odalis Perez
by world dictator on May 26, 2009 2:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh sorry I skimmed too quickly, disregard.
by hans on May 26, 2009 2:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Though it does look like Odalis pitched better than Oliver last year.
Really, they’ve had similar FIP the last three years.
by world dictator on May 26, 2009 2:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We already have Odalis Perez. His name is Juan Salas.
Juan Salas: Smartest man in baseball?
by emd2k3 on May 26, 2009 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
seriously, though… what would it take to get Cain? too much probably.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You do not want to go get a pitch to contact guy out of the NL West. You may think you want that but believe me, you don’t.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Up until this year though, he was a dominant pitcher who couldn’t get any run support. He has the lowest run-support of any active pitcher in the majors.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is a dominant pitcher in the NL West.
I cannot emphasize enough how big of a deal I think where he pitches and against who is; it is a fundamentally easier league-one where CC Sabathia made Matt Cain look like a chump.
His numbers against:
San Diego: 101 IP, 2.62 ERA.
Dodgers: 70 IP, 3.97 ERA
Rockies: 89 IP, 3.11 ERA
Arizona: 70 IP, 3.18.
I get that Cain has good numbers overall, so good splits follow; I’m just not all that interested in a guy with unimpressive K:BB numbers coming over into the harder league.
If we’re going to go after a young pitcher, I don’t think Cain’s the target. If anything, I think his numbers make him overvalued.
by afh4 on May 26, 2009 12:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
in 12 games against the AL, Cain has allowed a .624 OPS. SSS, but pretty good. Plus he wouldn’t have to face the MLB team that he has had the hardest time against (1.008).
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 26, 2009 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Plus he wouldn’t have to face the MLB team that he has had the hardest time against (1.008).
If you’re going to try to argue the numbers pick some that aren’t static.
by jhon on May 26, 2009 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why should we care about his run support?
by jhon on May 26, 2009 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure, but maybe 2. We certainly don’t go into the season with just that same set…if only there was some word that we could define as….something something….“the same” and “different”
by dgcambridge on May 25, 2009 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, Rondon and Gomez. Plus, a possible Pavano re-sign. Plus, more dumpster diving. They’ll be more depth options.
I think the magic number is something like 9-12 guys you could conceivably see in a rotation in some weird reality.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, so long as we’re not talking about how we break camp. Of those 10-ish guys, you still need 7 or 8 in May. This whole 75% failure rate is going to wreck you no matter how many dudes you have.
Seriously, if Vishnu were one of our young starters, three of his four arms would be injured right now.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Yeah, but hope springs eternal. You keep figuring: they can’t have a 75% failure rate again, right? That isn’t possible, even for Cleveland.
by odradek on May 25, 2009 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would agree with you except to the extent that some these guys have spit the bit, or at least declined in some respect, in back-to-back years now. When do we stop thinking of them as “recovering” or “adjusting” and start thinking of them “just not as good as we’d hoped”?
by fleerdon on May 26, 2009 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just Not as Good as We Hoped: Sowers, Lewis, Reyes?
Adjusting: Fausto, Westbrook, Laffey?
What’s interesting is the Tribe has a long list of Not As Goods, from Fernando to Jason Davis. But not many who met or exceeded expectations. I suppose that’s normal for teams, though.
by odradek on May 26, 2009 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Isn’t it way premature to put Lewis in the category of not as good as we hoped?
by world dictator on May 26, 2009 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes. It proceeds from bitterness and disappointment.
by odradek on May 26, 2009 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fausto’s mechanics are all messed up. This is bad for his control and possibly for potential re-injury. I’m really starting to wonder what the coaching staff has tried or hasn’t tried because its been pretty damn apparent that he’s been off. And I point to his release point changing from his 2007 season, which is sometimes an unfortunate outcome from an injury.
by hans on May 26, 2009 2:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He also needs to move over towards first on the rubber at least when pitching to lefties.
Juan Salas: Smartest man in baseball?
by emd2k3 on May 26, 2009 10:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The fourth arm would have an upside-down BB:K ratio.
by fleerdon on May 25, 2009 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Seriously, if Vishnu were one of our young starters, three of his four arms would be injured right now.
Quote of the week, perhaps the month.
by woodsmeister on May 26, 2009 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
“I believe in the Church of Baseball…”
by FranklinScott on May 26, 2009 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think a Pavano resigning is unlikely considering the inflated free agent contracts starting pitchers usually get. Even so, I’m not sure if i’d support resigning Pavano on more than a two year $5 mil deal.
by world dictator on May 26, 2009 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pavano’s made a bunch of money already and the Indians gave him a deal he liked and stuck by him. He’s likely going to make decent money off incentives this year.
It’s never a good idea to assume a sweetheart deal but Pavano seems like a decent candidate.
by afh4 on May 26, 2009 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I prefer not to base my assumptions on players NOT being greedy. But who knows. We’ve seen players stay loyal to Cleveland and Shapiro before. Though usually they’re homegrown players.
i just think that the potential money for a starting pitcher is likely to exceed what we’re willing to pay Pavano
by world dictator on May 26, 2009 12:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
5 mil total? You’re crazy if so.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 26, 2009 12:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pavano is going to get something like… shoot, I donno, $40m/4 years… probably from the Yankees.
by gte619n on May 26, 2009 9:28 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
For all I know, Jensen and Raffy are going to turn back into relief aces.
by afh4 on May 25, 2009 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just throwing this out there: Matt Belisle has started 43 games in his career.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 25, 2009 11:51 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I wanted this guy two years ago when he was posting a decent FIP but suffered pitching in CIncy. Heck Chad Gaudin has done the same thing. I’d love it if the Indians acquired either of these two because of how cheap they are. You can throw Dave Bush in the mix but I think the Brewers know what they have in him. Andy Sonnanstine is probably not going to be in TB past this season.
by hans on May 26, 2009 2:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hilarity in watching the 8th inning from the Indians’ broadcast booth:
“You get the feeling that Thayer is one of those classic in-between guys. Really good in AAA but not good enough for the bigs.”
As Jeremy Sowers earns his first win of the year.
Il faut d'abord durer.
by CU Adam on May 26, 2009 12:03 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I was at this game, only the second game I’ve ever gone to. The first 3 1/2 innings sucked. Obviously I share the concerns about Fausto and the pitching staff. But the ninth inning was totally the most amazing thing ever. I yelled myself hoarse along with the rest of the crowd (what was left of it).
Never give up! Let’s hope this game is a microcosm of our season.
Baseball isn't boring. YOU ARE.
by Matt Y. on May 26, 2009 12:08 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I was going to be there but I got off work too late to make the drive up. Of course.
I become an expert simply by doing something.
by fwembt on May 26, 2009 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We’re there many fans left in the stands?
If you believe it's just a game, you're also probably wondering why Santa keeps skipping your house every year.
by LeftyCatcher on May 26, 2009 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, I didn’t really look around and compare the amount that remained to the amount that were there earlier. Probably half of those in my immediate area had gone. We made a lot of noise compared to the earlier part of the game. Had a good GRA-DY, GRA-DY chant going at one point during his plate appearance.
Baseball isn't boring. YOU ARE.
by Matt Y. on May 26, 2009 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good for you for staying. You earned the reward.
by still ill on May 26, 2009 1:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
To be realistic, I’d have to say the Tigers look like the best team in the Central. When you looked at their pitching in March, you’d think: They suck. And look at them now. Why doesn’t that ever happen in Cleveland? We have promising facets that suck…
by odradek on May 26, 2009 12:15 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Wait! We still have one more out left in the game. Can we use it tomorrow?
I bailed out of the game after the 3rd inning, then checked gameday to see how badly we lost, but found we had come back 10-8 and Francisco had just walked to put the bring the winning run to the plate. wow! At that point I knew we were going to lose 10-9 with the last out a coming on a called strike three. I would have put money on it.
Great come-back, great for the home team fans in the stands who stuck around.
If you believe it's just a game, you're also probably wondering why Santa keeps skipping your house every year.
by LeftyCatcher on May 26, 2009 12:34 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Just finished watching it. I just wish it had come against someone other than Tampa, the only other AL team I like.
So glad it was Victor. It has to be hard to be so good on such a bad team. He needs moments like this.
Il faut d'abord durer.
by CU Adam on May 26, 2009 1:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Just realized, too, that between this and the Syracuse win in the Lacrosse National Championship, there were two absolutely mind-blowing comebacks today. Wish I’d watched this one live.
Il faut d'abord durer.
by CU Adam on May 26, 2009 1:08 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
How did that happen. When we were at lunch yesterday, Syracuse was down by 3 with just over 4 minutes to go. Wow, crazy stuff.
by talonk on May 26, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let’s go magic.
Case of the beet bandit. Missing beets from all over the farm, no footprints. Inside job. Mose in socks. Boom. Case closed. -Dwight Schrute
by mjschaefer on May 26, 2009 1:29 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
???
Are you referring to the Orlando Magic? Or just baseball magic to heal the team?
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin
by Spidey on May 26, 2009 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It best be the latter
I'm *always* in the driver's seat, cugino -- Chuck
by Turkmenbashi on May 26, 2009 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Recced for this great piece of writing…
I’d love to think of this as an important win in the context of the season, and if it is one I’ll be thrilled, but future expectations shouldn’t be shaped by some concept of an ‘emotional turning point.’ With Carmona’s dismal performance and the transactions of the day, this Indians’ pitching staff is no longer the one which we all envisioned being part of a playoff push and as the staff loses it’s war of attrition against the rest of the league, Cleveland becomes a shell of it’s projected self.
These game summaries are great – really great! Thanks for the hard work.
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin
by Spidey on May 26, 2009 10:01 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yea, I really enjoyed that too. It encapsulated the feeling I had when I saw the Indians had won last night.
by Toxicadam on May 26, 2009 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow. Just got my wireless going after an 18 hr trip back to Istanbul. This recap has me wired and ready to defeat jetlag!
by macasson on May 26, 2009 10:34 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I didn’t DVR this game. Anybody know of a way to watch the whole 9th inning on line?
"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter
by Denver Tribe Fan on May 26, 2009 12:05 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
There’s a highlight reel on mlb.com of the error, a couple walks and the Vic single.
FE WEE
by westbrook on May 26, 2009 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Garko HR, too. Gets most of the good stuff, plus you skip the 427 pitching changes.
by FredOx on May 26, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I missed it too and watched the replay online. I like the new options on MLBTV online to be able to jump to a specific spot in the game. I watched the bottom of the ninth and didn’t get to bed for another 3 hours.
Baseball fans are junkies, and their heroin is the statistic. - Robert S. Wieder
by jerseywahoo on May 26, 2009 1:13 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
i still wonder why wedge isn’t playing garko more often.
We're really bad this year. How's that for a signature?
by mixmasterasia on May 26, 2009 5:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Are you being serious? He’s played in just shy of 75% of our games, which, for a guy who provides no defensive value and a .750 OPS, is pretty generous.
by APV on May 26, 2009 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, he had a .750 OPS last year, but since he had an .842 OPS at age 26, it’s not preposterous to think he can do it again.
He’s gotten hot here, so Wedge will ride him for a bit. I’m like many that don’t see a reason he should be on the 2010 roster, but it’s probably not fair to pigeon-hole him as a .750 OPS guy.
by TribeJay on May 27, 2009 12:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He’s likely to hit between .750-.850. Unfortunately, to make up for his poor defense and base running he needs to be in the upper end of that range as a first basemen to justify his playing time
by Roger Dorn on May 27, 2009 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because he already plays too much and isn’t very good.
I become an expert simply by doing something.
by fwembt on May 26, 2009 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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