Game 72: Indians 5, Pirates 4
Before the morale-crushing ninth inning, the Indians played a very good game. David Huff pitched his best game as a pro, going eight full shutout innings, and allowing just four hits. Huff had come to the majors before he was really ready, but he's overcome the steep learning curve. Tonight he commanded his pitches in the strike zone very well, and unlike Jeremy Sowers, was able to go through the full batting order three times. He left after the eighth having thrown 112 pitches. Even as bad as the bullpen has been this season, there's no justification to risk an injury just to close out a single game. Especially now since this and all future games this season are in essence meaningless.
Grady Sizemore returned to the lineup, and showed no sign of rust, going two for five. He hit what was scored a triple in the third (the Pirates' right fielder took a horrendous route on a Sizemore liner, and the ball got past him), driving in the first two runs in the game. Later in the inning, Jhonny Peralta would drive in two more, chasing starter Ian Snell in the process. Jhonny homered in the sixth to plate the Indians' fifth run. With David Huff pitching through the eighth, the Indians' traditional pitfall inning, surely a five-run lead would be safe for one more inning, right?
Matt Herges and Kerry Wood pitched as bad as humanly possible in the ninth while only giving up four runs. Herges started the inning by giving up an Adam LaRoche bomb, then gave up hits to two of the next three hitters. That brought on Kerry Wood, who had blown two saves last weekend in Chicago. He looked just as bad in Pittsburgh, not being able to spot any of his pitches where he wanted them to go. Jack Wilson doubled, then he blew away Delwyn Young with fastballs. Andrew McCutchen then drove in the third run of the game with a single. Now the tying run came to the plate, and what was left of Wood's confidence seemed to evaporate. He walked the next two batters unintentionally to bring back to the plate Adam LaRoche. Everything seemed set up for another spectacular loss, especially after the count went full. But the unexpected happened: LaRoche flew out, the Indians won, and Wood notched a "save".The FanGraph had the Indians' win percentage in that last at-bat at 72.3%, but it didn't know that Kerry Wood was pitching.
Next Up: Pavano vs. Duke, 7:05 PM

| Highest WPA | Lowest WPA | ||
| David Huff | .289 | Mark DeRosa | -.088 |
| Grady Sizemore | .218 | Matt Herges | -.044 |
| Jhonny Peralta | .146 | Luis Valbuena | -.041 |
1 recs |
58 comments
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Comments
Jhonny’s opposite field power is returning. This is a good sign
by Roger Dorn on Jun 23, 2009 11:20 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Turning point. I just can’t figure out what we’re turning toward.
by FredOx on Jun 23, 2009 11:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Grady only went two for five, not three. However, it was great to see him back in action and playing well, even if it was as a part of a miserable victory.
by Chief Wahoo on Jun 23, 2009 11:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I am not as down about this game as it seems everyone else is, but I also wasn’t able to watch. To me, Huff pitching 8 awesome innings outweighs a meaningless item in the win or loss column
by Roger Dorn on Jun 23, 2009 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Very true, Huff’s outing was extremely encouraging.
by Chief Wahoo on Jun 23, 2009 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It would be nice to see some K’s or GB’s, if we want to be picky about it.
by bewwolv on Jun 23, 2009 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Pirates did seem to get some line/fly outs that could have easily gone as xbh outside of PNC or with wind or bad luck.
by danvail on Jun 24, 2009 7:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Watching it did help kill it. I was thrilled going into the ninth. I just can’t remember exactly what I felt like. But it was a win. Grady came back and was pretty awesome. And most importantly to me Huff was outstanding.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Jun 24, 2009 12:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree. Bullpens change, Huff is forever.
by gte619n on Jun 24, 2009 9:01 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
See the leverage bars at the bottom? The red ones taste like torture.
by dgcambridge on Jun 24, 2009 9:13 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Right now… what do we think Lee/Westbrook/Laffey/Rondon/Huff is in 2010 in terms of an MLB-ranked staff. Something like 8th to 12th on paper?
by cheech99 on Jun 23, 2009 11:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I’m not ready to give up on Carmona for 2010 just yet…. Especially now that there’s no pressure for him to return this season and he can spend the next three months working on whatever it is…
On paper, I feel pretty good about a Lee/Westbrook/Laffey/Carmona/Huff rotation (assuming some kind of return to some kind of form by Fausto), but it would be pretty tenuous, since the options after that are uninspiring… Do we think Rondon will be ready for next year?
In any case, it’s too far away, with too many question marks as jake says, to think about ranking them.
by Logodaedalus on Jun 24, 2009 12:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rondon in 2010 seems early. Maybe a callup midseason due to injury/underperformance,etc but to start the season, I’d think not.
by world dictator on Jun 24, 2009 1:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, Rondon and Lofgren seem to be setting up to be 7th/8th starters for 2010.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
by Jay on Jun 24, 2009 1:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Would it kill this organization to take a chance on Rondon as a viable option going into spring training? I’ve seen lesser pitchers (Porcello,,,, yeah I know the GB%) advance to the big leagues by skipping a level(s).
by hans on Jun 24, 2009 1:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why are you assuming he wouldn’t get a chance if he prove himself?
by world dictator on Jun 24, 2009 2:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It isn’t just about taking a chance on a prospect, it’s also about creating depth. You’re going to need more than five starters. If you start off with an extra veteran and use the under-ripe prospect as a backup option, you end up with a stronger roster overall.
Teams that do things like start the season with Porcello aren’t “taking a chance” on a young guy; they’re admitting that they failed to acquire adequate depth in the first place. Sowers got 14 starts in 2006, Carmona and Laffey got 41 starts in 2007, Laffey and Sowers got 38 starts in 2008, and Huff and Sowers will get plenty of starts this season. All of them started those seasons in the minors.
Would it kill this fan to recognize that this is a smart way to do things?
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
by Jay on Jun 24, 2009 8:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agree. I do think that the idea that Rondon needs a full year at AA and a full year at AAA is overblown. But 7th or 8th seems about right. We will see 7th or 8th. Huff was 7th this year, and that seems like a decent comp.
by dgcambridge on Jun 24, 2009 8:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Easy, #1.
You’re forgetting Carmona. (seriously)
by gte619n on Jun 24, 2009 9:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I honestly don’t believe the Indians will have an above #15 rotation next year without a trade or major free agent signing.
by NickFantana on Jun 24, 2009 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t like Rondon up yet. This club gets to dump $5mil of Dero’s salary, and how much of Delucci’s salary next year…in my book that’s about 8mil that we can spend on a decent 2/3 starter….or save it and sign Lee to 3 more years (and don’t jump all over me, I know that happening keeps getting slimmer every day, but it’ll be worth a shot to extend him here at the end of the year).
Otherwise, I like Lee, Westbrook, Laffey, Carmona, and Huff. Not bad. Huff has proven he’s at least a 4 starter, so having him penciled in at 5 looks okay to me!
by MooneysRebellion on Jun 24, 2009 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Except that neither of those guys were ever under contract for 2010, so you haven’t really freed money you were otherwise going to spend. As of right now, you have about $69 million in payroll obligations for 2010 to Hafner, Lee, Wood, Martinez, Betancourt, Westbrook, Sizemore, Peralta and Fausto, assuming the club picks up the options on Lee, Martinez and Betancourt. So the idea that there is an $8 million pot of money to be spent is probably wrong. Even if there were, here is what you could have had for $8 million this year: Bartolo Colon, Tom Glavine, John Bale, Mark Hendrickson, Carl Pavano, Horacio Ramirez, Mike Hampton, Tim Redding, Chan Ho Park, Daniel Cabrera, Brad Penny, Randy Wolf, Braden Looper, Andy Pettitte, John Smoltz, Jon Garland or Randy Johnson.
by FredOx on Jun 24, 2009 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If I’m not missing anything, which is far from a guarantee, my back-of-the-envelope calculations say that this is the payroll situation for next year:
Those 9 players: $69M
Arbitration: Shoppach (made about $2M this year)
League Minimum: 15 other players * ~0.5M = $7.5M
That’s a total of around $78-79M… so assuming the budget stays constant from this year (also not necessarily safe — it could go down), that leaves a maximum of $4M to spend on new signings. If they don’t pick up Betancourt’s option, which is the most likely among the three players with 2010 club options not to be picked up, and it is replaced by a league minimum contract, that frees up about $5M (though of course one needs to take into account the decrease in food and beverage sales that would result from games being a few hundred cap and jersey tugs shorter). So optimistically, there could be around $9M to spend on pitching, between starters and bullpen help. I’m not sure how far that’s going to go either. Probably not a “decent 2/3 starter” in the FA market, even if the whole bundle were spent on one player.
by Logodaedalus on Jun 24, 2009 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You don’t just get to pay exactly 25 guys, and lots of the guys on multiyear deals will get raises.
You go with $9M available, I’ll go with zero. We’ll see who’s closer.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
by Jay on Jun 24, 2009 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was taking Fred’s $69M as given. And you’re right, of course, that you have to pay more than 25 guys. I’m offering $9M as an extreme high end estimate, to get to the conclusion that signing a “decent 2/3 starter” on the FA market is not realistic, even under the most optimistic of circumstances.
So that’s where that comes from. I’m certainly not willing to take even odds on $9M available versus zero.
by Logodaedalus on Jun 24, 2009 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Damn! Thought I had a sucker bet.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
by Jay on Jun 24, 2009 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was at the Nationals-Red Sox game tonight and spent as much time watching the Indian’s score as I did the game (the Nationals are our crappy twin in the NL). The 9th inning was excrutiating, losing the shutout and then watching the Pirates creep closer and closer. I was sure we would lose.
If you believe it's just a game, you're also probably wondering why Santa keeps skipping your house every year.
by LeftyCatcher on Jun 24, 2009 12:11 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I’m just glad the ownership/GM didn’t do anything rash. This tribe’s immense confidence would be shattered such a move.
by oxforddave on Jun 24, 2009 1:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think an interim coach is going to stop Kerry Wood from still sucking.
by Toxicadam on Jun 24, 2009 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But how can you be sure?
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
by Jay on Jun 24, 2009 1:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
To me the should we fire Wedge discussion boils down to this:
1. Eric Wedge has made mistakes but its not his fault the Indians are performing poorly.
2. The manager is rarely the primary cause behind a team’s performance
3. You don’t fire a manger because you blame him, for a fresh perspective, to bring change, to light a fire under your teams behinds, etc
4. After seven years the Indians need all of the above
5. Fire Wedge
Ironically, I think the Indians best shot at still contending this season, before the brewers cubs fiasco, was to fire Wedge and see if that lit a fire under our players.
All I ask, is that if we fire Wedge can we please please please get a new pitching and bullpen coach. I don’t know enough about Wills to say he’s done a bad job, but I certainly think we need a fresh perspective there more than anywhere.
by world dictator on Jun 24, 2009 2:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
3. You don’t fire a manger because you blame him, for a fresh perspective, to bring change, to light a fire under your teams behinds, etc
Sorry, that should read:
You don’t fire a manger because you blame him, you fire him in order to get a fresh perspective, to bring change, to light a fire under your teams behinds, etc
by world dictator on Jun 24, 2009 2:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I still wish the Indians had fired Wedge May 18th. At the time, the team was 14-25. Since then, they are 16-17. It’s quite possible the team we have had out there these past 5 weeks is a .500 club in terms of talent, and that Wedge has been doing a fine job. But this was/is a big season for the Tribe based on the current pool of talent they have, contract status, etc….and it ran away from them fast. And in sports, fair or not, accountability for player performance tends to fall on the coach. At this point, I don’t have strong feelings one way or the other about keeping him around this season.
by APV on Jun 24, 2009 3:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I totally agree – except for not having strong feelings about keeping Wedge for the rest of the season.
I think a lot of us are convinced that 6+ seasons of mediocrity and underperformance means Wedge needs to go. I’m worried the team will catch fire in September and we’ll be stuck with Wedge for another year, and 2010 will be another slow start and another year of underperformance.
If you believe it's just a game, you're also probably wondering why Santa keeps skipping your house every year.
by LeftyCatcher on Jun 24, 2009 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow. I would never have guessed that we’re playing almost .500 ball for this stretch. It goes to show how some really painful implosions can affect the mood of the season. I mean, this place was quite hopeful right before the Milwaukee series.
"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter
by Denver Tribe Fan on Jun 24, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Quite hopeful up to about the eighth inning of the first Milwaukee game.
by odradek on Jun 24, 2009 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because I can be pretty sure that Datz, Skinner or Luvello are all going to coach in a similar fashion. All are going to have the same kind of approach and mindset that Wedge has.
That’s the one thing I respect about some of the “Fire Wedge” brigade. They also say that Shapiro should go too, because they realize that Wedge is just the antithesis of what Shapiro wants a coach to be. They go hand in hand. Just because you remove him, doesn’t mean there is going to be this magical “fresh perspective” that is going to embolden the players to play better.
So, if you want Wedge gone because it is one step closer to getting rid of Shapiro, fine. But if you think the systemic problems of this team are merely because of Wedge’s presence on a daily basis, I think you are wrong.
by Toxicadam on Jun 24, 2009 2:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think you mean the apotheosis, not the antithesis.
I assume that Datz, Skinner and Lovullo are not night-and-day different from Wedge in terms of basic philosophies, but what this really comes down to is preparation, leading the coaching staff, making tactical lineup and in-game decisions, and handling relationships with individual players. I think it’s fair to assume they’d each do a significant number of things differently, and in any event, it’s time to find out.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
by Jay on Jun 24, 2009 8:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We’ve already had a taste of Skinner. Hard to remember that far back but I recall Wedge’s style in his first year was quite different than Joel’s (and I liked the difference at the time).
If you believe it's just a game, you're also probably wondering why Santa keeps skipping your house every year.
by LeftyCatcher on Jun 24, 2009 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
“They had me on the ropes,” Wood said. "We got a little help with that last at-bat. He could have just as easily not swung at it and walked to tie the game.
This is a ringing endorsement of confidence.
by Toxicadam on Jun 24, 2009 6:50 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Accountability.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
by Jay on Jun 24, 2009 8:27 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
hey, he could have said “I was really tired out there from taking Emergency Baserunning Practice pre-game and running in from the bullpen reaggrivated it”
FE WEE
by westbrook on Jun 24, 2009 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d like to give a shout out to Peralta’s defensive work at third last night. He wasn’t flashy, but I was impressed with a solid defensive effort. Coupled with his work at the plate, it was an encouraging sign.
by elsandito on Jun 24, 2009 7:48 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Not to sound too much like Wedge, but it’s awfully frustrating that we’re looking for encouraging signs from a guy who’s supposed to be a key veteran.
Though I look right at home, I still feel like an exile
by Manhattan Tribe Fan on Jun 24, 2009 8:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Peralta’s performance last night didn’t just have “encouraging signs,” it was a great performance.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
by Jay on Jun 24, 2009 8:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And, my two cents, I think it would be very understably tough to move from shortstop to third base in the middle of the season when you’re one of the longest tenured players on the team. I’m actually very sympathetic to what Jhonny has had to go through under Wedge.
That being said, it’s still very frustrating how inconsistent he can be and has been since he entered the league. Certainly all of this upheaval can’t be helping.
by NickFantana on Jun 24, 2009 9:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, you’re right. I’m just really frustrated with him.
Though I look right at home, I still feel like an exile
by Manhattan Tribe Fan on Jun 24, 2009 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Went to the game last night, and after dropping my fiance off at her father’s house, headed westbound on I-80. arrived back in Cleveland Heights at 12:55, 5 minutes ahead of schedule.
It was the 2nd time I’ve been to PNC, and it’s a beautiful park. Last night though, it struck me how small it feels. It doesn’t quite feel like a major league ballpark, but has too many seats for a AAA stadium. I can only imagine, that with a town full of rabid, bandwagon-hopping sports fans, the park was built with many years of futility ahead of them in mind.
It was great to hear the solid cheers from Cleveland fans throughout the park, although the remaining Pirates fans became fairly vocal (as would be expected) in the 9th. I’m just glad I didn’t have to walk out of the ballpark with an L, having a yinzer remind me about their football team for no less than the 7th time throughout the night.
You know Selig? Ombudsman.
by rolub on Jun 24, 2009 9:32 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
PNC is great. I prefer it to Camden Yards, although my personal list of new stadiums in which I’ve seen a game is pretty limited. You’re right about the size – with a capacity of 38,496, only the A’s and Rays play in smaller venues. The new Marlins stadium is planned for 37,000; Target Field in Minnesota for 40,000.
by FredOx on Jun 24, 2009 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Went to my first game at the new (well, almost) Nationals Park last night. The park seats 41,888 (they had a record crowd of 41,500 last night).
I’m not sure how I feel about the stadium. It doesn’t feel like a traditional baseball stadium (the field is 24 feet below street level) so the stadium doesn’t rise high above it’s surroundings. This means a lot of the seats are just above or below street level so there are no long climbs for anyone. It was a breeze to get in and out of the stadium despite the record crowd. The Metro station is just a 2 block walk from the stadium and the station handled the crowd well despite the horrific wreck the day before.
Now all they need is a major league club to play there.
If you believe it's just a game, you're also probably wondering why Santa keeps skipping your house every year.
by LeftyCatcher on Jun 24, 2009 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I need to go see a game at PNC – I don’t think I’ve come across an account that wasn’t complimentary of it.
by Ryan on Jun 24, 2009 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it’s because you probably always gloss over the negative. probably looks something like this:
i saw the pirates play at…
by Brick. on Jun 24, 2009 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

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