Game 101: Angels 7, Indians 6
by Ryan on Jul 29, 2009 1:44 AM EDT
in Game Recaps
183 comments
The offense continued to churn along, but tonight the eighth inning reared its ugly head yet again. But even despite giving up four runs in the eighth inning, the Indians had a very good opportunity to tie the game in the ninth inning.
David Huff gave up three runs in the third, but thanks to a great defensive play, the damage was limited to just those three runs, and he continued into the eighth inning. After David retired the Angels in order in the seventh, Eric Wedge, seeing the upcoming matchups, sent Huff back out the next inning. At this point Huff had thrown about 100 pitches, and although the bullpen problems have been widely documented, I thought going to the pen was a better risk than to trot back out to the mound a tiring young starter.
Alas, Huff allowed the first two Angels to reach base, setting the stage for a big inning. Joe Smith was called upon with runners on first and second and nobody out, and although he allowed the tying run to score, got a double play to quiet things down. But Tony Sipp, brought on to get the final out in the eighth, walked the first two batters he faced, and then gave up a back-breaking three-run double to Gary Matthews, Jr.
Despite the meltdown, the Indians almost took advantage of an Angels implosion. Brian Fuentes, who has done an excellent job closing games for the Angels this year, for the second night in a row couldn't retire a batter. He walked Andy Marte, gave up a double to Asdrubal Cabrera, a single to Jamey Carroll, and walked Shin-Soo Choo. Angels manager Mike Scioscia removed Fuentes, bringing in Jason Bulger to try to clean up a bases-loaded mess. Victor Martinez was next up, and he grounded into a double play that would not normally be turned on most other major-leaguers. A run scored, but now there were two outs, and Jhonny Peralta would need to drive home the tying run with a base hit. Instead, he hit a grounder to short to end both the game and the Indians' five-game winning streak.
Andy Marte made his 2009 Indians debut tonight, playing first base. Assuming no other major trades happen, he's likely to share playing time with Victor Martinez the rest of the season, and make an occasional start at third. The Indians aren't really looking at his defense, but his hitting, since he has yet to show that he can hit major-league pitching.
Next Up: Laffey vs. Lackey, 3:35 PM
| Highest WPA | Lowest WPA | ||
| Shin-Soo Choo | .142 | Tony Sipp | -.370 |
| Jamey Carroll | .127 | Victor Martinez | -.316 |
| Asdrubal Cabrera | .091 | Luis Valbuena | -.092 |
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Funny thing about Marte last night … he swung at exactly three pitches, and he put all three in play (though not with particularly hard contact). Not one swing-and-miss or foul ball. That seems like a good thing, but mostly, it just seems odd.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
I know our relievers aren’t the most reliable guys in the world (understatement at minimum), but I know when I pitched out of the bullpen in college, it was much, much, much easier to start a new inning than to come into one during the middle of the inning. It usually took me one batter to get settled in. Wedge always seems to wait just a batter or two too long to bring in relievers. Its not easy to come in and blow guys away, especially after your starters have gotten you into a mess.
Now, I realize that is the job of the relievers at the major league level…I’m just saying, from personal experience, its not easy. I kind of gotta place the whole 4 run 8th, squarely on Wedge’s shoulders. Huff is too young and doesn’t have the stamina yet to go 8 innings in close ballgames.
Good effort by Huff overall tonight though. Nice to see him doing moderately well. Hopefully he can work with a coach over the winter and really turn into a decent 3-4 starter for us. LGT!
by MooneysRebellion on Jul 29, 2009 8:12 AM EDT reply actions
Managers will always get second-guessed, either for pulling a guy one batter too early or too late.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
I’m not saying Wedge’s job is easy….by no means, I sure as hell couldn’t do it. But, like you’re bullpen or not, I kind of gotta figure that Wedge could tell Huff was tiring. I don’t know. I just don’t think Huff had anything left in the tank, and I think the bullpen could have done less damage had they started fresh in the 8th. Guess we’ll never know…so it probably really doesn’t matter how much we discuss it.
by MooneysRebellion on Jul 29, 2009 8:22 AM EDT up reply actions
This is so true.
If Huff is pulled, and the bullpen blows it, the screams will be “why did you pull a pitcher having a great game.”
If Huff is left in to struggle, the opposite happens.
I agree with Ryan, I would have liked to have seen Sipp start the inning then give yourself the option of Smith for 1 out … or Wood for a 4-out save.
But, since this season is basically down to player evaluation, I can see the reasoning for pushing Huff as well.
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 8:39 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t know if Huff was having a “great” game. He pitched pretty well but it’s not like he was throwing a shutout. I don’t think anyone would have complained if Wedge would have went to the bullpen at the start of the inning.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 29, 2009 9:17 AM EDT up reply actions
True, great was overstating it.
Smart fans wouldn’t have complained no … I’m talking about the run-of-the-mill fans who like to second guess every move the skipper makes.
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions
i really liked keeping huff out there, even if it was perhaps questionable as far as winning the game was concerned. the kid needs all the experience he can get, he mowed through the 7th, there were two lefties coming up, and it was a great teaching/evaluation opportunity.
i thought he might not come out for the 7th after the way the 6th went, but once he did and he hammered the angels in the 7th, i very much wanted to see him back for the 8th.
by DontCallMeJoey on Jul 29, 2009 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I disagree. Huff was most likely going to pitch to two batters that inning (both lefties) regardless of outcome. I will take a 100-pitch Huff than any guy we have in the bullpen for those batters. That’s just the reality of the situation.
In normal years, you would have a defined setup guy that would come into that situation. Or you have a guy that you can come in and leave inherited runs stranded. We haven’t really found one guy that can do that. this year. Sipp has the stuff for it, but not the mentality.
We’ve got way to may guys in our system that don’t have the mentality to pitch….we really need to find a coach that could work on that. Hmmm….wonder if we could pry Dave Duncan away to be our manager next year, assuming that Cheapiro fires the Atomic Wedgie at the end of the season.
by MooneysRebellion on Jul 29, 2009 8:28 AM EDT up reply actions
Seriously. Go to cleveland.com with that crap.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 29, 2009 9:20 AM EDT up reply actions
we really need to find a coach that could work on that.
Our pitching coach has a small piece of the last two Cy Young Awards. What does Duncan have?
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
Right.
And the best pitching coach is usually the guy who guides his team to the 9th best ERA in the league that year.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
I am not saying I think Willis is a bad pitching coach I just don’t think you can say Dunca isn’t one of the best. That being said he stays with the Cardinals unless Tony leaves and then he probably goes with Tony.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Jul 29, 2009 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Oops. Sorry Jay, accidentally hit the flag button as I was trying to hit another one … please ignore that.
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 9:38 AM EDT up reply actions
As long as its a bare-knuckle ping pong cage match … to 21.
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m steering clear of this one. By a mile.
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 9:28 AM EDT up reply actions
Well, to be fair, he did change the cleveland.com script by inferring that Shapiro is cheap. Standard Ignorant Bitching Rule 1.1 clearly states that the Complainant is to use the phrase “Dolan is cheap” or its equivalent, preferably in ALL CAPS.
I don’t like Atomic Wedgie much either. Surely we can do better.
Outside of the actual suggestion that Shapiro/the FO is cheap, this was one of my huge problems with it. The complaint should be directed towards ownership because saving money is not Shapiro’s concern unless ownership makes it his concern. I’m sure any GM in the game would love to spend, spend, spend.
Further down my list of problems is the lack of an creativity or wit to “Cheapiro.” Doesn’t even sound good.
Steel Nick
I had this exact thought
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions
owner sets budget. the GM operates within the confines of the budget. the GM could be considered cheap if he continually underspends relative to his budget (obviously not shapiro), but given that winning is what keeps a GM in his job it is advantageous to use all/as many resoureces alloted to him (her)
by clusterchuck on Jul 29, 2009 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m not going to question him leaving a guy in too long, but I think in general Wedge has been took quick to take guys out who aren’t pitching terribly, as few and far between as they’ve been. Sipp just flat out stunk though.
by supermarioelia on Jul 29, 2009 9:20 AM EDT up reply actions
I kind of gotta place the whole 4 run 8th, squarely on Wedge’s shoulders.
Listen, you can make the case that we could have tried something else, hindsight and all that as caveats. But to say the entire 8th inning was Wedge’s fault is a little irresponsible. Really? Our bullpen couldn’t have pitched any better? They gave up runs, right?
Steel Nick
Absolutely correct.
Smith and Sipp have to, if not escape completely, at least minimize the damage.
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions
I think Wedge probably gets as many bullpen calls right as he gets wrong, so I won’t hang him for it, but I would have pulled Huff for the 8th, too. Ultimately, though, guys have to perform in the situations into which they are placed, and none of the three in that inning did so.
Also! I know Andy had three outs and no drives, but it was still great to see him get on base three times. It’s like me at my son’s little league games (Nolan’s more Mark Shapiro than Mark DeRosa).
so when does today’s “trade rumors” fanshot start?
USSMariner, via our own VegasWatch’s twitter, reports Seattle C Jeff Clement was pinchhit for in the 3rd inning last night while DH’ing. someone who is claimed to be a reliable source said it was not injury related.
the missing piece needed to complete the CLE/TB/SEA trade?
You are reading my signature.
To TB, hopefully. I really don’t understand speculation that we would want Clement. Let’s take Kendrick while we’re at it.
I like the idea of having an extra “game” thread every day leading up to the deadline. Hammy said it on the radio this morning, it’s like a double header every day this week.
Steel Nick
Did you guys catch the Buerhle coverage on SportsCenter?
They showed the last guy to retire the first 15 batters, two games in a row … was Jeremy Sowers last year.
What the hell?
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
maybe if Sowers would grow out the Buerhle style scruffy beard, he’d pitch like Buerhle.
by MooneysRebellion on Jul 29, 2009 9:48 AM EDT up reply actions
You’re on time-out. Go sit in the corner and be quiet.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
by Jay on Jul 29, 2009 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Ed Price of Fanhouse Twits:
#Mariners are making a trade. Jeff Clement (pulled from AAA game last night) is part of a deal. Details when available.
I wonder if he’s confirmed that he was pulled in order to be traded
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions
How about Ed Price being the breaking news star of this trading deadline?
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Geoff Baker in the Seattle Times:
At any rate, I’ve been led to believe that there’s definitely something brewing with Clement, who as we all know by now was removed for a pinch-hitter in the third inning of Tacoma’s game at Reno. By all accounts, there was no injury or illness involved. It doesn’t appear he’s being called up to the Mariners, because manager Don Wakamatsu was in the dark after the game. I now have little doubt that he’s going to be traded, and it could be announced today.He also says “I’m expecting a Clement trade, and it wouldn’t shock me if Brandon Morrow was part of it.” Earlier, Baker speculated thusly:
There have been recent rumors of a three-way trade involving both Clement and Brandon Morrow going to Cleveland, Victor Martinez and Cliff Lee to Tampa, and Scott Kazmir and shortstop Reid Brignac to Seattle.The buzz on Twitter suggests the Clement deal is likely much more minor. Twitter also tells me that Joey Clement was pulled from his start (as bassist for David Cook).
If Clement is the only person we know is moving, I somehow doubt it’s part of a huge deal. We’ll see.
Steel Nick
I wonder if he could be paired with Washburn to the Brewers.
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions
This seems like one of those crappy deals made up by fans who think they’re eh players are future all stars
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions
I know.but it still doesn’t make enough sense on face for me to accept it as legit. For example, where is Tampa getting the money to pay for Lee’s salary. Second, if a top rated pitching prospect was involved wouldn’t they be frequently mentioned in the trade deals? The majority of rumor talk has only talked about Brignac.
I don’t know just seems very…sketchy.
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions
But Kazmir isn’t being included in the Seattle trade. And until Kazmir is moved, if he’s moved, then we’re just relying on a what if to prove a what if.
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions
in the rumored trade above, yes he is:
There have been recent rumors of a three-way trade involving both Clement and Brandon Morrow going to Cleveland, Victor Martinez and Cliff Lee to Tampa, and Scott Kazmir and shortstop Reid Brignac to Seattle.
You are reading my signature.
Seattle must be giving up a lot more than that
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions
i doubt that we would trade for another catcher, even if we moved martinez. i think if this is part of a 3 way deal with sea and tb, its more likely that martinez is not part of the deal and that clement is going to tb
by clusterchuck on Jul 29, 2009 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions
There have been recent rumors of a three-way trade involving both Clement and Brandon Morrow going to Cleveland, Victor Martinez and Cliff Lee to Tampa, and Scott Kazmir and shortstop Reid Brignac to Seattle.
I would be significantly underwhelmed by this
i think those 6 players are close, but the destinations are off and other prospects would have to be included.
Lee/Martinez for Clement/Morrow? no.
You are reading my signature.
Once again—and this is all rosterbation anyway—there is no mention of what TB is sending to Cleveland, most likely because this article is written for a SEA audience.
Steel Nick
Yeah it’s gotta be, because that’s not even close to enough of a haul, even for just Cliff.
by supermarioelia on Jul 29, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions
And let’s pull back a little bit and realize this is not someone reporting facts. There’s no need to argue it.
Steel Nick
agree to disagree. wait no, just agree.
by supermarioelia on Jul 29, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions
But I doubt if we’re getting Morrow and Clement (and I assume Davis) we’re getting much else of substance.
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions
http://www.letsgotribe.com/2009/7/29/967262/game-101-angels-7-indians-6#18871767
You are reading my signature.
Also! Those are pretty hilarious in theory.
In addition to some of my Earlier ideas, I’ve also thought of maybe playing on the “in your mom’s basement” idea.
Steel Nick
Agreed. Except we need it now
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions
I hate to do this but, in light of the above about Clement, there’s this somewhat related complex trade rumor from Ed Price’s home site, MLB FanHouse:
According to a Tampa Bay source, the Rays are still working on getting catcher/first baseman Victor Martinez and left-handed pitcher Cliff Lee from the Indians, but it could wind up being a very complex deal.
According to another source, whose team is not involved, Tampa Bay and Cleveland may be working with the Los Angeles Angels on a three-way trade that also involves Rays lefty Scott Kazmir. That source said both the Indians and Rays had scouts present Tuesday as left-hander Trevor Reckling, a top Angels prospect, struck out nine and allowed one hit in seven innings for Double-A Arkansas.
This makes a lot more sense.
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions
I think I’m mentally ready for Cliff and Vic to be traded.
by supermarioelia on Jul 29, 2009 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions
I am not.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Jul 29, 2009 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions
You remind me of that creepy old dude on family guy
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t watch that show. Kids today watch such strange things on Television.
Really, though, I think it’s terrible. I have seen some clips (Jeopardy and Cool Whip) and they are amusing, but I can’t stand watching the whole show all at one time.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Jul 29, 2009 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions
You don’t watch Family Guy?
That’s just racist…and I don’t associate with racists.
I say good day sir
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions
How I Met Your Mother
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Have you seen that episode?
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Dude. Great episode. It might be in season three though. How far have you gotten?
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions
I started this way: bits and pieces of S4. Someone let me borrow S3. Then I went through S1 and am about halfway through S2.
Steel Nick
Interesting. Kind of sucks because I think season 2 is the worst of the three. Still really good but not quite the legendariness of season 1 and 3.
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Worst of the four*
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Like I said its still really good. But relative to the other seasons its the weakest.
I guess it depends on how you like your HIMYM. I prefer the Ted-Barney dynamic to the Robin-Ted relationship. The show is better when Ted and Robin aren’t together.
But slap bet is awesome.
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
Well sure, I’m just saying that it would seem Ted and Robin getting together is a huge deal on the timeline.
Well Ted/Barney is great, I think Anyone/Marshall is the best part of the show.
Steel Nick
Groan
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s a guy show. Like I said I found some things from it amusing but I find a lot of it jeuvenile and annoying.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Jul 29, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions
I SAID GOOD DAY SIR!!!!
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions
57 year old guys aren’t guys?
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Family Guy’s a guy show? I’ve never really gotten that vibe from friends of mine.
by supermarioelia on Jul 29, 2009 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions
I’ll say it: Family Guy kinda sucks.
"Some days are better than others, but it's a long season."
— The Inestimable Eric Wedge
Correction: sucks really badly*.
And how do y’all watch all these shows? Office? FG? How I met your Mother? AD (which we talked about last year, which also sucks)? I’m not being high and mighty – it just becomes work after a while to keep track of these explicitly ordered things.
True. The scripted drama genre never has inspired me to conform to the programming order – I did watch 24 for a while. I think I generally stick to history channel/discovery channel (Deadliest Catch), the news, and I’ll snag some food network here or there to get ideas about how to cook for myself. But my predominant tv interests are “reality documentaries” and, of course, Tribe baseball.
It was once brilliant. It’s gotten a little old.
by Logodaedalus on Jul 29, 2009 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions
(Caveat: I haven’t watched it much lately. Just an episode here and there)
by Logodaedalus on Jul 29, 2009 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I like shiny new things. We’ve been watching Vic and Cliff for a while. Vic’s a great guy. Cliff’s dominant. Time to move on.
by supermarioelia on Jul 29, 2009 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions
Indians general manager Mark Shapiro stated firmly on Wednesday that he does not need to trade left-hander Cliff Lee and catcher Victor Martinez for financial reasons.
Per Rosenthal
“We have zero imperative from ownership to move money,” Shapiro said. “That’s not a component in our decision-making at all.”
The Indians’ declining revenues, however, are forcing Shapiro to proceed with the understanding that he cannot supplement his major-league roster this off-season.
So, in trade discussions for Lee and Martinez, he is weighing the impact of the possible returns on next season’s club vs. the impact of keeping either or both players.
If we don’t cut payroll I’d be very impressed with the Dolan’s
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:46 AM EDT reply actions
I thought we’re already saving like $19 billion over the next four years from moving Betancourt.
Steel Nick
$18 billion. GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT DAMNIT
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions
I droll at the amount of money we would have if we traded Lee/Vic AND didn’t cut payroll. A pipe dream but ah what a dream
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions
i’m not sure why. we’d be looking for awesome deals with that cash, no? like the ones we already have available for lee and cliff.
Except without the prospects
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions
There will be some minor built-in payroll deductions … but keeping Vic and Cliff would still put about a $70 million roster on the field.
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions
Incomplete thought … I wonder if moving them would give the team $16 million in “wiggle room” for additions …
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions
That’s my point. And its more than $16 million
"sometimes the internet is hard for me." - ClemsonGirl
by world dictator on Jul 29, 2009 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions
Philly prospects Carrasco and Taylor scratched from today’s game in Lehigh, per Will Carroll’s RT.
You are reading my signature.
We’re gonna see baseball’s first ever 30-team trade.
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions
As long as Riccardi gets stuck with Dunn somehow … I’m good with it.
by FallsTribeFan on Jul 29, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions
yeah i was gonna make the joke up thread but figured it would come up again.
by supermarioelia on Jul 29, 2009 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions
I met a guy in an Expos cap yesterday. It looked brand new, so I asked him how that could be. He said he hadn’t worn it in a while, but he decided it was time to pull it out again.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
Ever get a chance to go to Olympic Stadium?
by supermarioelia on Jul 29, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Went to the Indians’ one and only series ever in Montreal, just days before we sent Colon there in 2002.
Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
Were they slamming those ugly yellow seats to make noise?
by supermarioelia on Jul 29, 2009 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
I went to a Marlins-Expos game years back with Dontrelle on the mound and Carroll playing 2nd for the Expos.
by supermarioelia on Jul 29, 2009 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions
It would be like a game of musical chairs — everyone gets up and starts grabbing players, and then someone takes away a chair, and when play resumes, the Yankees no longer exist.
by Logodaedalus on Jul 29, 2009 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions
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