Game 83: Oakland 5, Cleveland 2

by Ryan on Jul 5, 2009 5:18 PM EDT in Game Recaps Comment 68 comments

Gio Gonzalez.

Despite have one of the league's most productive offenses, the Indians just don't score when Cliff Lee pitches. Today the left-hander fought control issues throughout the game (he walked four in six innings), but limited the damage to three runs. Normally that would be enough for the Indians, for they average over five runs per game.

Gio Gonzalez, who was traded three times while he was in the minors, (2005 (Jim Thome), 2006 (Freddy Garcia), and 2008 (Nick Swisher)), was the most impressive of the three young pitches who started for Oakland this series. Gonzalez relied heavily on his curve, and that pitch had Indians hitters off balance all game. He struck out 8 in six innings of work, his best performance as a pro.

The Indians held both Travis Hafner and Victor Martinez out of the lineup. Hafner was sitting to rest his shoulder, and Victor to give him a day off to help him recover from a prolonged slump (.195/.306/.378 over the last four weeks). During the game, Victor was named to the AL All-Star Game, the only Indian to make it.

Before the game, GM Mark Shapiro announced that there would be no coaching changes until at least after this season. While the announcement does remove any uncertainty as to the immediate future of Eric Wedge and the rest of the staff, I don't really know what the next three months is going to tell Shapiro that he didn't already know. The Indians are pretty much in the same situation now that they were last season, with the division race already over for them, and three months of looking at young talent ahead of them. Wedge has done a good job working young kids into the mix (as long as likes them), but he hasn't done well keeping teams in the race early in the season. Unless Shapiro just wants to keep him around for three months to do what he does best, I don't understand the move.

Next Up: A day off, then a trip to Chicago.

290705105_athletics_indians_133566709_lbig_medium

via www.fangraphs.com

Highest WPA		Lowest WPA
Grady Sizemore	.053	Chris Gimenez	-.133
Ryan Garko	.039	Ben Francisco	-.114
Jhonny Peralta	.032	Cliff Lee	-.052

0 recs | Comment 68 comments | Share

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

If there was a subsequent deal of sorts, where some contending team wanted Winston Abreu(presumably with another piece, sort of like Cousineau lays out) … would we have to go out of our way to hold him out of games until said deal is completed?

by cheech99 on Jul 5, 2009 5:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

If he is indeed one of the parts heading elsewhere … then, it might behoove the Tribe to not pitch him, in order to avoid injury.

If he’s not … then it’s weird.

by FallsTribeFan on Jul 5, 2009 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Is it possible that maybe something is brewing for Kerry Wood….. I mean Veras, perez, abreu, RAFFY L and RAFFY R to finsh out the year (this will not have any worse results)??? Not many team could take on his salary but I was just curious about maybe Kerry moving

by NCTRIB on Jul 5, 2009 9:15 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Highly doubt it…

*Few teams could take on that salary
*Value at an all time low
*Kind of hinders our ability to sign future free agents (if we’re known to deal them 3 to 4 months into long-term deal
*Finished games clause to trigger 2011 option not looking good (at least this year)

by cheech99 on Jul 5, 2009 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, I shouldn’t have been so quick to point out the finished games clause. Looks like he’s about 49% there (27 out of 55) and we have 51% of the season under our belts (83 out of 162). Worth monitoring…

by cheech99 on Jul 5, 2009 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Raffy R is much more likely to get dealt once he’s activated … no way the Tribe (or any other team) picks up that option for next season.

by FallsTribeFan on Jul 5, 2009 9:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

This pitching boxscore looks familiar, just not the success. Betancourt with the win, Lewis the hold.

Columbus
Player	         IP	H	R	ER	BB	SO	HR	ERA
Carmona, F 	5.0	6	1	1	1	5	1	1.80
Betancourt, R 	1.0	0	0	0	0	2	0	0.00
Lewis, J 	2.0	2	0	0	0	5	0	0.00
Kobayashi 	1.0	0	0	0	0	1	0	5.19

by TribeJay on Jul 5, 2009 10:45 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs

That is unbelievable.

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Jul 5, 2009 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

What’s unbelievable is four innings of scoreless relief pitching.

by odradek on Jul 6, 2009 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

THESE RESULTS TELL US NOTHING, NOTHING I TELL YOU!

by world dictator on Jul 6, 2009 8:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Let’s just stack Columbus with the best players who have options left and bring home the International League title.

You know Selig? Ombudsman.

by rolub on Jul 7, 2009 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Make them winners! Let them taste it! Prepare them for the winner’s life!

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Jul 7, 2009 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Guys, just checking in from the ER here, and you’ll never believe this.

I just saw a Korean patient whom his parents have nicknamed….Fausto. And no, no relation to any Indians fandom, but cool nonetheless.

by supermarioelia on Jul 5, 2009 11:33 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs

If you see a Dominican patient named Choo, tonight, I’m calling your supervisor because it’ll be clear that you’re working too many hours.

"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter

by Denver Tribe Fan on Jul 6, 2009 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, Jimmy Choo is from Malaysia, which is right next to Indonesia. Tom Mastny is from Indonesia, and now plays for the Yokohama BayStars. Yokohama is in the Central League. The Chunichi Dragons also play in the Central League, and their roster includes infielder Tomás de la Rosa, who was born in La Victoria, Dominican Republic.

by FredOx on Jul 6, 2009 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Six degrees of separation. Excellent!

"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter

by Denver Tribe Fan on Jul 6, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’d just like to pop in and take credit for the Chooooooooo game. I came from North Carolina for the long weekend, saw my first game in years, and my favorite player went nuts. If anyone would like to get me a well-paying job in Cleveland, I could get us back into this thing.

by Chemo on Jul 6, 2009 11:22 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I’m off to Chicago to see tomorrow’s game. Wish me luck. I don’t want White Sox fan alcohol all over me or some other type of horror story.

Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?

by ClemsonGirl on Jul 6, 2009 12:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Good luck. I’ll be at the Thursday game. Have not been to Chicago since my high school senior trip in 1973. Any do’s or don’ts?

by shenvalee on Jul 6, 2009 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

As I recall it, don’t sit in the front row of the upper deck if you have vertigo.

"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter

by Denver Tribe Fan on Jul 6, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i always thought that was always way overplayed by locals used to only old comisky and wrigley. even before they sliced off the top 6 or whatever rows of the upper deck, it was no worse than any other stadium built since, i don’t know, world war II.

the real reason to avoid the upper deck is that you’re not allowed in the lower levels thanks to the trash that made it trendy to attack people on the field and the lower levels have much more to offer. that, and the trash still hangs out in the upper deck.

last tip. don’t make fun of the carlton fisk, hair loss adds above the urinals. fans will fight you.

by Brick. on Jul 6, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks for the tips. I did get lower level seats from stub hub. I plan on being a wuss and wear plain, non team identifying clothing. I’ll try and keep a straight face while at the urinals. LOL We also are going to Wrigley on Friday.

by shenvalee on Jul 6, 2009 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’m going to Wrigley on Friday, too. My 9 year old likes both the Indians and the Cards (when they’re not playing the Tribe), so we’ll see Pujols and company on Friday and the Indians next Thursday.

by FredOx on Jul 6, 2009 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That’s so weird. My 12 year old is also a Cards fan (for no apparent reason other than Pujols is phenomenal), and roots for the Tribe only on my behalf.

"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter

by Denver Tribe Fan on Jul 6, 2009 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

We lived in STL for a time, so my son has some justification for his rooting interest. More, frankly, than for his love for all things Tribe. Other than the risk of abandonment by the side of the road, of course.

by FredOx on Jul 6, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’ve always liked the Cards. I think it’s their hosiery.

"Some days are better than others, but it's a long season."

— The Inestimable Eric Wedge

by emd2k3 on Jul 6, 2009 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

We’re seeing the Cardinals play in Milwaukee on Wednesday.

Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?

by ClemsonGirl on Jul 7, 2009 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’m having serious fan MLB withdrawl. My realistic options are the Yankee’s AAA team (no thanks) or driving the 3 hours to Philly, but I had driving in to that city, especially if its for a team I don’t care about. Enjoy both games!

Shin-Soo Choo, future U.S. Citizen.

by USSChoo on Jul 7, 2009 2:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’m looking forward to Wrigley. It’s one of the parks I’ve always wanted to experience.

by shenvalee on Jul 6, 2009 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

There’s a great story in there about the near “Fisk-fight”…one which I have had the pleasure of hearing.

by The DiaTriber on Jul 6, 2009 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Gotta disagree with Brick on the seats. I sat in the upper deck there several times when the park first opened. I don’t have a problem with heights or vertigo and still felt like I was about to be launched onto the field at any second.

FWIW, shenvalee, I lived in Chicago for 7 years and wore every stitch of Tribe gear I owned to every game at old and new Comiskey and never got any flack for it.

"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter

by Denver Tribe Fan on Jul 6, 2009 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

really, any more than other newer ballparks? feels the exact same as progressive field or the freaking united center to me.

by Brick. on Jul 6, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, at the time I was comparing it to Wrigley and Old Comiskey, where I spent most of my time. The only time I got to the Jake it was in the lower deck. Definitely more incline than Coors’s upper deck. Haven’t made it to many of the other newer ones, I admit.

"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter

by Denver Tribe Fan on Jul 6, 2009 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’m with you, Brick. No worse than any others. Because I grew up watching games at Municipal Stadium, I don’t like to watch baseball surrounded by people. So I try to set in the upper reaches of the upper deck at the Cell, where a man can stretch out and watch the clouds. Not bad at all. Only problem now are the speakers blasting out from the roof.

by odradek on Jul 7, 2009 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

and yes, wear your tribe gear.

by Brick. on Jul 6, 2009 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Alright, I’ll break out the script I hat and tribe T.

by shenvalee on Jul 6, 2009 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Go for it.

"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter

by Denver Tribe Fan on Jul 6, 2009 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’m wearing my brand new Grady jersey. I’m excited.

Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?

by ClemsonGirl on Jul 7, 2009 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I saw Grady up close yesterday. Bet yer jealous.

by jhon on Jul 7, 2009 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’ve seen him up close before.

Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?

by ClemsonGirl on Jul 7, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

This was before the restraining order, right?

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Jul 7, 2009 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I got his autograph the day after we choked in 05. Dude wasn’t very happy. And I loved that.

Proud Fan of the Worst Baseball Team I've Ever Seen

by westbrook on Jul 7, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Unhappy that you asked for his autograph?

He drove what I considered a nondescript sedan—not the classic convertible—but my buddy who knows cars explained that it’s much more impressive than that. Serious car, serious appearance. In conclusion: Grady’s serious.

by jhon on Jul 7, 2009 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I paid like $20 for it.

Proud Fan of the Worst Baseball Team I've Ever Seen

by westbrook on Jul 7, 2009 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Of course he is.

Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?

by ClemsonGirl on Jul 8, 2009 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

but if you do get a horror story you know you’re posting it right?

by world dictator on Jul 6, 2009 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I guess so. But where?

Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?

by ClemsonGirl on Jul 7, 2009 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Today’s fun fact:

After games played on July 6, 2009: Indians 11.5 GB
After games played on July 6, 2005: Indians 11.5 GB

Though I look right at home, I still feel like an exile

by Manhattan Tribe Fan on Jul 7, 2009 8:39 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs

I don’t see anything fun about it.

You know Selig? Ombudsman.

by rolub on Jul 7, 2009 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah, we’re going to choke under the pressure again and it will be wedge’s fault!

by Brick. on Jul 7, 2009 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not the worst of the Wedge era (that’d be 2006). Certainly not the worst of my lifetime (7/6/69: 24 GB). But I still prefer 1999, when we had a 14 game lead on July 6.

Google Chart

by FredOx on Jul 7, 2009 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh, 90’s. You were fun.

I just don’t see anything fun about being 11.5 back.

At least in ’05 at that time, the team was .548 with a +51 run differential. Kinda fun, but not super happy fun.

You know Selig? Ombudsman.

by rolub on Jul 7, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It was mostly the fact that that team had a real shot at winning the division in September.

Though I look right at home, I still feel like an exile

by Manhattan Tribe Fan on Jul 7, 2009 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Abreu, Garko, and Sowers.

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Jul 7, 2009 10:27 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Deal!

"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter

by Denver Tribe Fan on Jul 7, 2009 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ah. The mobile site works. Just need a link at the top to fanshots.

by Brick. on Jul 7, 2009 11:59 AM EDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs

Wait, there’s a mobile friendly LGT now?

"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter

by Denver Tribe Fan on Jul 7, 2009 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

There’s long been a mobile friendly site. What they finally got around to adding was mobile posting.

by FredOx on Jul 7, 2009 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

You mean I can start truly posting from the mound?

Proud Fan of the Worst Baseball Team I've Ever Seen

by westbrook on Jul 7, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sure, why not? Now SBN needs to link our account here to Facebook and Twitter so you can cross-post after your 27th consecutive ground ball out.

by FredOx on Jul 7, 2009 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Does Jensen Lewis know this??

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Jul 7, 2009 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks! I’ve been downloading the full site onto my Blackberry for two years.

"Lotta heart in Cleveland." - Ian Hunter

by Denver Tribe Fan on Jul 7, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Cool! As soon as I get my new Smartphone, I’ll be a posting fool during work hours.

I believe in Carl Pavano.

by salome on Jul 7, 2009 7:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

With mobile commenting, I finally have thr much-needed excuse for typos…

Stuart Dean

by stuart dean on Jul 7, 2009 4:46 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs

…DeRo to the DL…

Proud Fan of the Worst Baseball Team I've Ever Seen

by westbrook on Jul 7, 2009 5:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hopefully, you guys won’t get vertigo if I return to the subject of this post……….
Ryan commented that the Indians don’t score much when Cliff pitches. If you recall, we used to score a lot of runs for him when he wasn’t our number one starter. On the other hand, we didn’t score many runs when CC pitched.
Managers like to pair the top end of their rotations against each other, so our lineup usually faces the best pitcher the opponent has to offer on the day Cliff pitches. There should be no mystery as to why we’d score fewer runs on those days.

by elsandito on Jul 7, 2009 5:08 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

This is certainly valid early in the season, but I’m not sure whether it still holds after the first month or two… Teams have off days at different times, and gradually get “out of phase” with their rotations as the season goes on. At some point you would expect the correlation to disappear.

I haven’t done the necessary research to know if this is true, but it strikes me that a potential alternative explanation for this could be that managers pick days when an ace is pitching to give key hitters the day off, figuring that it won’t take as many runs to win that day. Again, I don’t know if this is true, but it seems plausible at least. It was certainly the case on Sunday.

by Logodaedalus on Jul 7, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

There is something to this, but perhaps less than you think. Those ace-on-ace matchups become pretty shuffled by the end of April, and they have little if any effect in May, June, August and September.

In 2007, 39 pitchers qualified for the ERA title. Fausto ranked 20th in run support with 6.82 (runs per nine innings pitched, scored while the pitcher of record), which made him the exact median in run support for AL starters that year. C.C. was 23rd, barely below the median. The difference in support (6.82 vs. 6.46) seems significant, but over 240 innings, it comes out to a little under 10 runs, so it seems unlikely to have produced more than one win by itself.

(Fans often fret about their lineup screwing their ace out of wins. C.C. was second in the AL in wins despite being only fifth in ERA, and he was 2nd in FIP as well. It should be obvious that if he got screwed out of wins, it was only to a normal or average degree.)

It’s important to remember that bullpen support plays a significant role as well.

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Jul 7, 2009 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs