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What Is Going On With Fausto Carmona?

What does this all mean? Why won't you tell us how you feel?

More photos » David Richard - AP

What does this all mean? Why won't you tell us how you feel?

 

As I wrote in the recap today, I'm pretty befuddled by what's going on with Fausto Carmona lately. I'm hardly alone in watching Fausto closely this season and primers on his performance thus far can be found here and here. In his start today, Fausto struck out 8 batters over 7 innings; this is an anomaly in the context of his whole career. Fausto has struck out 7 or more only 7 times in his career. His bread and butter has always been a dominating sinker and, as junkballer pointed out in fwembt's fanpost and Fangraphs noted in a separate article, he appeared to be relying on it even more as he struggled in the early part of this season.

However, the story at this point has changed. What's notable right now is Fausto's not throwing the sinker, a pitch that was once his entire story. In his best season, 2007, Carmona had only one start in which he induced more flyballs than groundballs: a one-inning exercise in self-immolation against Oakland. In 2008, Carmona struggled mightily but still maintained a groundball percentage of 63.5%. Before today, that same statistic for 2009 had tumbled to 55.6%. Let me just emphasize that this is not a pedestrian number of groundballs: Carmona would still be one of the most extreme groundball pitchers in the league if he were qualified.

Star-divide

However, it is a number that looks like it might be falling even lower: since his return from the minors, Fausto has posted a 51:42 GB:FB ratio, a number that matches the ratio of Javier Vazquez and John Lackey, guys who deservedly have no reputation as groundball artists.

What in the world does this all mean? Well, let's take a look at a classic Carmona start. On May 20 of this year, Fausto went 6.0 innings againt the Royals. He didn't pitch partiularly well but he did present the peripheral that has generally been indicative of a "succesful" Carmona start: a 4 to 1 ratio of groundballs and flyballs. It appears that pitchFX generally has a problem classifying Fausto's sinker but, assuming that groundballs equal an increased use of the sinker and that an increased use of the sinker is indicated by working lower in the zone, it's instructive to just look at Carmona's clusters. Here's Fausto's start on the 20th, 107 pitches:

Numlocation_php_medium


Now, here's Fausto's start today, 116 ptiches:

Numlocation_php_medium

Pretty jarring. He's clearly working in more of the zone, expanding his pitches to the middle of the plate and even elevating relatively often. He's also clearly just in the zone more, period.

But what does he throw where? Again, the groundball heavy start against the Royals first:

Location_php_medium

Doing a little counting, it looks like Carmona elevated his changeup more often than his fastball but, well, he hardly elevated either. Clearly, he threw the fastball low in the zone and if he missed higher, he missed high off the plate. 

 

Now, his start today:

Location_php_medium

 

When I went and grabbed this graph, I expected him to elevate his off-speed pitches more often than his fastball. That's not the case at all. Carmona didn't come up with the off-speed stuff any more often than he did against the Royals: the pitch he worked up in the zone was his fastball.

So, what we've got so far: newly minted Fausto is not emphasizing the bottom of the strike zone like he once did and he's throwing his fastball up in the zone more than he once did. But, what about all these strikeouts? Where did they come from? And what about the groundballs he once got? Were those actually coming from working the bottom of the zone?

His start against the Royals:

Location_php_medium

The groundball outs come from a combination of the bottom of the zone and coming off the plate, assumedly coming in and busting righties on the knuckles. His minimal strikeouts weren't distributed in any way. More or less what we would've expected. 

His start today:

Approach_php_medium

The groundballs have moved to the other side of the plate and the strikeouts are at the bottom of the zone. Groundballs first: Fausto got his groundball outs today against lefties, almost exclusively, so it's not surprising that they came from working the right side of the zone, inside against lefties. The strikeouts: they were equal opportunity lefty to righty, with three righties sitting down and five lefties. They also came on a variety of pitches: five by fastball, two by changeup, and one on what's deemed a sinker (an 89 mph pitch). However, by location, seven of the eight were clearly low in the zone. 


I'm not prepared to synthesize all this information and I'm also not prepared to say that it isn't just a fluke run in what's going to be a career for groundballs for Fausto Carmona. However, after watching Carmona today, he looked fundamentally different than he ever has. Are we entering a part of his career in which we can no longer determine if he will be successful simply by looking for groundballs? With his plummeting groundball rates does it make sense to look for groundballs at all? Is this new model of success, with an expanded use of the zone, one with which Carmona can succeed long term? Aren't the homeruns (only one in his last 29 innings) going to be a problem soon? Is the sinker ever coming back? Was the pitch on which he got seven low-zone striekouts today a version of the sinker? 

 

Does anyone know what's going on with Fausto Carmona?

 

Huge h/t to brooksbaseball.net, fangraphs.com and baseball-reference.com.

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Comments

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Interesting how the list of qualified GB% leaders is so dense with NL starters. No AL starter cracks the top five or comes in as high as Carmona — Halladay is tied for #6 with 52.1% — and only three AL starters are over 50.2%. Not at all like 2007, which featured AL stalwarts Lowe, Carmona, and Wang, plus Felix, all around 60% and eye-popping rates from non-qualifiers Laffey and Westbrook.

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 24, 2009 12:25 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

As a side note it’s also interesting how much success Felix is having this year with such a reduced GB rate (from 60.8% in 2007 to 51.7% this year). Striking out a batter more per inning doesn’t hurt, I guess.

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Aug 24, 2009 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Probably worth noting that Laffey’s GB% is at 48.9 right now. Not sure what’s going on with him, either.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 12:35 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Might just be sampling error and injury.

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 24, 2009 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Much as I like my name in lights, Junkballer is the one who wrote the analysis of Fausto. I posted it for him because he didn’t have an account at that point.

by fwembt on Aug 24, 2009 12:26 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

You can watch all the strikeouts here, although they don’t show the sequence of pitches. I suppose you can watch that reasonably enough here.

The four-seamer was a pretty golden pitch today. I know it’s Manning’s opinion and you can take it for what you will, but he pointed out how much harder of a pitch it is to lay off when the count is in the pitcher’s favor, and what an easier pitch it is to throw for Carmona when he doesn’t risk falling further behind. Amazing what not falling behind will do. Maybe the reason he’s pitching more in the zone?

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Aug 24, 2009 12:30 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Just watched the condensed game.

I think at least 3 of the strikeouts were on the sinker just falling out of the zone.

Also, LaPorta’s defense: fine.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 12:49 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe Phifer’s giving some advice now that eh doesn’t have to worry about Fausto stealing his Cy Youngs.

This is Victor's home. Victor Jose, you too.

by westbrook on Aug 24, 2009 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i tend to agree with you… if you look back at most fausto starts this year he usually breaks even in ball/strike ratio

if he can get ahead (like he did against a weak M’s lineup) he can force them to chase stuff down in the zone… especially when he’s run fastballs up to 95-96 mph like he has his last two starts

by gorilla_baller on Aug 24, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

They also came on a variety of pitches: five by fastball, two by changeup, and one on what’s deemed a sinker (an 89 mph pitch). However, by location, seven of the eight were clearly low in the zone.

Just watched the strikeouts again. Four were on the sinker, three were on a changeup. The one that was a called strike three was either the four-seamer or the sinker, I couldn’t tell.

And, as you mentioned, that’s part of the problem with the classification of pitches by pitchFX. Unless you’ve watched Carmona a lot, it can be tough to tell what he’s throwing. And then it’s still a question on some pitches, as I’ve shown in the above paragraph. I do know that If the radar gun shows an ‘8’ as the first digit, it’s either his changeup or slider. Not his sinker.

by TribeJay on Aug 24, 2009 1:08 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

This is true, but I think the larger point that he is working in a four-seam fastball that is showing up in the above graphs as a fastball and is up in the zone (relative to his traditional work as noted above as well) is quite interesting, a pitch he may well have more control of than the two-seam fastball right now. Control is what it comes down to with him going forward.

by hans on Aug 24, 2009 1:16 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You’re calling a sinker what the computers are counting as a four-seamer, then?

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Aug 24, 2009 5:05 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Because Fausto’s “sinker” is thrown so hard, it more often than not is getting called a 4-seam fastball. If you look at the horizontal and vertical movement of it, and compare it to what he was throwing in 2007 (which you can do at fangraphs), it appears to be the same pitch. But he’s not as consistent with it and for some reason he isn’t getting all the groundballs.

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 7:35 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

To the naked eye I would say it was the same thing, yes.

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Aug 24, 2009 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

In those particular examples, yes.

by TribeJay on Aug 24, 2009 8:29 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Personally, I have about 1% confidence in what the computers call different pitches at this point.

by Ryan Kelsey on Aug 24, 2009 10:17 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I care less about what they call them. I care more about how accurate they are reading the motion of each pitch….if that’s accurate, it doesn’t matter what they call it.

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

maybe. But it doesn’t seem consistent even from pitch to pitch. I don’t know if I’m more skeptical of the pitch fx data and the consistency of how it reads or the “analysis” both by the computer and humans on what that data actually means. But the end result is, I’m beyond skeptical at this point.

by Ryan Kelsey on Aug 24, 2009 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

there’s reason to be skeptical too… sampling rates are still low (if it were higher i’m not sure how easy it would be to stream the data to gameday), depending on the day and the ballpark the camera systems might report conflicting results due to calibration error, obviously the algorithms that defines pitch type are a bit screwy, and the list goes on… but all in all it provides fans more information and capable stat-heads with another toy to play with that can produce some pretty good results when used properly… but it’s not perfect, and if you fail to treat it as such you’ll begin to find incongruities

by gorilla_baller on Aug 24, 2009 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed. I enjoy it mainly on gameday. And I enjoy the general idea of the information I get on fangraphs that, I believe, comes from it (i.e., average speed of different pitches). But I just don’t trust it enough to base any grand thoughts or theories on it.

In other words, this is one area that I still trust what I and others see with their own eyes versus what the more “advanced” method tells me.

by Ryan Kelsey on Aug 25, 2009 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I kind of look at him like Rocky, when he trained himself to switch from lefty to righty.

-Kyle

by Kyle Garret on Aug 24, 2009 1:46 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Is this new model of success, with an expanded use of the zone, one with which Carmona can succeed long term?

Would there be any other time that a pitcher had so drastically changed approaches and was just as successful post switch?

by fwembt on Aug 24, 2009 2:43 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

isn’t this what halladay did at one point?

If you don't respect Aaron Laffey, I will fight you.

by Cap'n Snegiryov on Aug 24, 2009 6:17 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That was gonna be my answer as well.

This is Victor's home. Victor Jose, you too.

by westbrook on Aug 24, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Clemens?

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 7:35 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Tom Candiotti?

"It's all part of life's rich pageant, you know?" - Inspector Clouseau

by woodsmeister on Aug 24, 2009 8:56 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Rick Ankiel?

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 24, 2009 9:05 AM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

You’re doing it wrong.

The once and future

by Manhattan Tribe Fan on Aug 24, 2009 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

And you weren’t too intimidated to say so.

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 24, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I think he’s simply becoming a “pitcher” instead of a “thrower” with great movement. This terminology probably gets tossed around too much, but there is some merit to it IMO. Fausto has gone his entire career with guys flailing away at that sinker, and now guys have adjusted. He’s really having to concentrate to keep that pitch from moving all over creation, and its taken him a year and a half to do that. Let’s hope he continues to control that movement.

Just one person’s opinion.

by MooneysRebellion on Aug 24, 2009 8:11 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I think what Wedge said after the game rings true. If he can get the sinker on the plate, then he can get hitters to commit, particularly when he’s ahead in the count. If it starts on the edge or off the plate, then the hitters just let it go. It’s not quite as simple is hitters just adjusting, though that’s part of it.

by TribeJay on Aug 24, 2009 8:34 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The other problem with Carmona over the last couple years is that he has sometimes unravelled when umpires would not give him the low strike (Dana DeMuth, anyone?). For Carmona’s long-term success, he has to have the ability to adjust when he’s not getting or not controlling that sinker. If Carmona can get people out consistently with his change-up or the 4-seam fastball, that’s huge, because it means he’s learning to pitch.

"It's all part of life's rich pageant, you know?" - Inspector Clouseau

by woodsmeister on Aug 24, 2009 9:00 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He needs to have a second trick, basically.

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 24, 2009 9:06 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Couldn’t agree more. And honestly, I think his 4 seemer has to be his starting point….and work the sinker off of it.

by MooneysRebellion on Aug 24, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

THIS… plus his change piece looked really good last night… if he can get ahead with the 4-seam fb he has a few legitimate options that will keep guys from having quality ABs against him

by gorilla_baller on Aug 24, 2009 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think this, and Wedge’s comments, are shortsighted.

Since his return from the DL Carmona has been verging on being an extreme flyball pitcher; he’s gotten extremely lucky on homeruns and, with some normalization, I think it might get ugly. I don’t see any reason to see a barely over 1 GO:FO as a sign of progress from Fausto.

Frankly, I think his performance since returning from the DL is a lot like Sowers: decent results but not very repeatable, at least on first blush.

Now, yesterday sort of changes things because he suddenly stopped walking guys and started striking guys out. However, if he’s not able to consistently keep guys off base and keep the ball out of play (if it’s not going to be on the ground) then I think this might be a bad thing.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think Carmona’s key is command. If he can throw strikes with multiple pitches, he’s going to succeed at some level because he has good stuff. If he can’t, his results will be erratic. There are lots of examples of successful flyball pitchers, but they generally have to have good control and very good swing-and-miss stuff…which Carmona had yesterday.

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If we really think this is happening, which I’m not saying is impossible, then I think it’s probably a much more notable story than just “becoming a pitcher.”

If that’s what’s happening, then he’s changing from Jake Westbrook into John Lackey which seems sort of insane, doesn’t it?

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

And sort of appropos, stumbled across this, which gives some flimsy support to the idea that a pitcher with groundball inducing pitches has a slightly suppressed HR rate on flyballs.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have no idea if it is really happening. Again, Fausto still seems to throw a very hard fastball with very good downward movement. That should still be a groundball pitch.

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let’s assume that his raw stuff is imposing to the point that he might continue to have trouble harnessing it., then perhaps

1 throwing the less erratic 4-seamer acts as a set of training wheels to bring him back to the plate and,
2 like a knuckleballer, albeit one on steroids, he needs something in his repertoire that he knows he can get over the plate…

There is a great need for a sarcasm font

by stuart dean on Aug 24, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe the right thing to ask is: will he get groundballs if he elevates that pitch? Because that’d what it looks like to me-less emphasis on pounding the bottom of the zone, assumedly to lose some of the walks.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 11:19 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

I suspect that his pitching coaches, as part of the reclamation project, have been telling him that he has to change the eye level on the batters – he can’t just keep pounding the bottom of the strike zone. The pitch that he can elevate is the 4-seamer. I suspect that it’s a purpose pitch, to set up the sinker, but yesterday it was working for him and guys were swinging at it and getting fly balls.

"It's all part of life's rich pageant, you know?" - Inspector Clouseau

by woodsmeister on Aug 24, 2009 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hmmm

There is a great need for a sarcasm font

by stuart dean on Aug 24, 2009 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes. This going from a thrower to a pitcher thing doesn’t seem to apply here. It’s not as if Fausto has refined the sinker and remained essentially the same pitcher. He has, if this is his plan from now on, completely changed the way he approaches the game. That’s not just making an adjustment, it’s the most radical thing a starting pitcher can do.

by fwembt on Aug 24, 2009 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hopefully this isn’t like the time Jake Westbrook did turn into John Lackey.

I still can’t help but wonder if this is what got him fast-tracked to Yocum.

This is Victor's home. Victor Jose, you too.

by westbrook on Aug 24, 2009 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Huh, APV’s description is what comes to mind when I think of the “becoming a pitcher” cliche. Less walks, hitting spots, relying on a varitey of pitch types.

by dgcambridge on Aug 24, 2009 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I just don’t think of the cliché applying to guys who totally change where their outs come from.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 3:40 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

We should try him at closer.

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Aug 24, 2009 9:23 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

And I’ll bet this Kerry Wood guy could be an excellent starter.

by danvail on Aug 24, 2009 9:37 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He might have the stuff to strike out 20 guys on a good day.

by JP_Frost on Aug 24, 2009 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That’s just crazy talk.

Everybody should get ice cream every day.

by junkballer on Aug 24, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

totally unpossible.

This is Victor's home. Victor Jose, you too.

by westbrook on Aug 24, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Was Brad Komminsk at the game?

"You just gotta roll with the ounches." - Clemson58YearOldMan

by emd2k3 on Aug 24, 2009 1:20 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Haha, nice move.

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 24, 2009 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

So here is an interesting comparison:

Fausto’s Aug. 6th start against the Twins

and Fausto’s start yesterday against the M’s

Both were good starts, and both were in Cleveland (hopefully minimizing the between stadium pitchF/X problems). Against the Twins Carmona went 6 innings allowing 1 run while striking out 2 and walking 3. But he got 13 groundballs, 2 flyballs, and 6 line drives. In yesterday’s start he obviously got 8 Ks to just one walk, and had 8 groundballs, 7 flyballs, and 3 line drives. If you play around with those pitch F/X outputs, what is amazing is how similar the two starts are. The upper left chart (h-mov/v-mov) appears to shift slightly up and to the left, but the basic separation of the three pitches Fausto is throwing (fastball, change, slider) is nearly identical. The same holds true with the charts plotted against velocity.

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 2:43 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Also comparing those starts….against the Twins 6 swinging strikes to 13 called strikes. Yesterday, 18 swinging strikes (a career high), 15 called strikes.

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It’s only just now that I realized how few non-contact strikes there are in a game. I’m genuinely amazed by this.

The once and future

by Manhattan Tribe Fan on Aug 24, 2009 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ok….last comparison.

So in 2007, Fausto threw strikes ~64% of his pitches. 25% of those strikes were looking, ~13% of them swinging. So about half as many swinging K’s to looking K’s.

His August 6th start against the Twins: 60% strikes, 22.5 % looking, 10.3% swinging…a slightly lesser version of his 2007 self.

His start yesterday: 65% strikes, 19.7% looking, 23.7% swinging…a different version of himself. Or maybe it isn’t Fausto at all (again, his stuff didn’t look all that different), maybe the M’s just really suck and are free swingers.

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

All very interesting. I’ll be interested in looking when I get home at where Fausto worked in the zone against the Twins. I agree that it looks like he’s throwing the same pitches but I’m interested in seeing what’s going to happen if he’s decided to consistently elevate. I guess the question is if he has ‘swing and miss’ stuff if he lives closer to the heart of the zone.

He’s a weird pitcher.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 3:17 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

Here are the two images you are probably looking for.

This is the strikezone plot from yesterday:

And here is the same plot from Aug. 6th:

If you can see major differences, you are doing better than me.

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed.

But if this is his new MO in terms of location and pitch selection, this Twins start is the results anomaly, right? He’s basically been around a 1.20 groundball ratio for the last month.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 3:37 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

He definitely looks to be trending towards more flyballs, less groundballs

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Is that the new dogma?

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 24, 2009 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If it isn’t, I need to send back a whole box of t-shirts

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

Once Ryan weighs in, your minions will have their contrary opinion suppression orders.

by FredOx on Aug 24, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Can someone let me know when it is settled so I can opine?

by Roger Dorn on Aug 24, 2009 3:50 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I’m staying with the old dogma: screw Jordan Brown.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 3:47 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

I really hope you never stop being a Tribe fan, Jay; It would suck for me to have to root for whatever new team you choose.

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Aug 24, 2009 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

speaking of which, I see Clifton is continuing to make a mockery of the NL

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

What choice does he have? It’s dogma.

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 24, 2009 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i’m already down to only facebook friends that jay also has. my wife still doesn’t understand why i de-friended her.

by Brick. on Aug 24, 2009 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Suckup.

"You just gotta roll with the ounches." - Clemson58YearOldMan

by emd2k3 on Aug 24, 2009 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You can’t teach an old dogma new tricks?

"You just gotta roll with the ounches." - Clemson58YearOldMan

by emd2k3 on Aug 24, 2009 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Shouldn’t have traded Franklin.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 3:48 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

HERESY

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 24, 2009 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

SNICKERS

by Brick. on Aug 24, 2009 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

SATISFIES.

"You just gotta roll with the ounches." - Clemson58YearOldMan

by emd2k3 on Aug 24, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Keep in mind the differences between the lineups. The Twins lineup on August 6th featured four guys with GB/FB ratios of 0.97 or higher (Span, Mauer, Redmond, Casilla), while the Mariners lineup featured six guys with GB/FB ratios under 0.66 (Branyan, Lopez, Griffey, Hannahan, Wilson, Langerhans). The only Mariner who hits a ton of ground balls is Suzuki; the only Twin who hits hardly any is Crede.

by FredOx on Aug 24, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Excellent point.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 3:18 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

I don’t know how the specific lineups those two dates differ, but as teams, the M’s and Twins don’t differ huge amounts in the GB/FB numbers or in their swing%.

by APV on Aug 24, 2009 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Confused as to how this jibes with Fred’s comment.

by afh4 on Aug 24, 2009 3:34 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

Comparing team totals the ratios are similar. Two things, though. Crede’s extreme fly ball tendencies skew the overall Minnesota numbers. The Mariners’ team ratio is affected in the other direction by Chavez and Johjima, neither of whom was in the lineup (for different reasons).

by FredOx on Aug 24, 2009 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don’t the Mariners take very few walks? I remember the guys at LL always joking about this.

by Toxicadam on Aug 24, 2009 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

From what I could glean watching on TV, Fausto seemed to attack more and nibble less.

"You just gotta roll with the ounches." - Clemson58YearOldMan

by emd2k3 on Aug 24, 2009 4:11 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

i just think he’s gotten his weight back down a little bit. really, i do think that. and i do think that matters, no matter what anyone esle thinks.

by Brick. on Aug 24, 2009 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

that should be *any one esle*. an esle is a baseball blogger. andrew is an esle, and jay and ryan and adam. no matter what any one or any multiple of those esles thinks....

by Brick. on Aug 24, 2009 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Rec?

"You just gotta roll with the ounches." - Clemson58YearOldMan

by emd2k3 on Aug 24, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

This reference isn’t made enough, here or anywhere esle.

The once and future

by Manhattan Tribe Fan on Aug 24, 2009 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

This is far far removed. But if anyone is sitting at home bored, I’d be interested to know “What is Going On With Trey Haley?” Audio link here.

by dgcambridge on Aug 24, 2009 5:18 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

End result for Haley: 5 IP, 3 H (singles), 2 BB, 0 R, 7 IP.

by dgcambridge on Aug 25, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ultimately, I don’t think he’s reinventing himself…but he is throwing more four-seamers, and yesterday he did trust his changeup more. Some of his success was due to the Mariners being their aggressive selves. Jose Lopez is still looking for his thumbs from that one AB. Like others, I need to see more.

Regarding the Laffey comments in this thread – his ground ball ratio is lower lately for much the same reason. With less fanfare, Laffey is throwing his four-seamer much more in the past month. He has had trouble keeping the sinker in the zone as well, and he’s really spotted his fastball well. It gets him ahead in the count and keeps guys off his other stuff.

by TribeJay on Aug 24, 2009 7:52 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Agreed. I keep thinking about Cliff Lee as I read this thread. Like, the model for Indians pitchers has changed from Jake Westbrook ’06 to Cliff Lee ’09. A well placed four-seam fastball can be extremely effective, even if you can only throw it 90-93. And its like Laffey just figured this out. Similarly, a straight fastball is not the end of the world for Fausto either.

by Ryan Kelsey on Aug 25, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah yeah yeah … where’s my goddam Comic Life? We need some pep!

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 24, 2009 8:46 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

[deleted, profanity]

by NickFantana on Aug 25, 2009 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

wut

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 25, 2009 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I thought that one was off-limits.

by NickFantana on Aug 25, 2009 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Seven dirty words, and that ain’t one of them.

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 25, 2009 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just because it’s censored on TV doesn’t make it profane.

by Logodaedalus on Aug 25, 2009 7:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Chatspeak “what” has some pretty good comedic use.

Steel Nick

by nickjs21 on Aug 25, 2009 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Picked it up from Andrew. I’m not much for chat-speak, but “wut” just cracks me up for some reason. It seems to convey a kind of dumbfounded, gut-level bewilderment.

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

by Jay on Aug 26, 2009 6:47 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I’m actually going to work today, where ComicLife lives.

by afh4 on Aug 25, 2009 10:20 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

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