2011 Winter Meetings: What Are The Indians To Do?
by afh4 on Dec 6, 2010 12:08 PM EST
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PrintThe 2011 MLB Winter Meetings are getting fired up. Every year around this time, baseball fans get real hot and bothered about the idea of baseball executives walking around the lobby of a hotel and holding hushed conversations over plates of chicken fingers at the bar. I've always found it odd that, in a world where Ellen Page makes commercials about telecommunications, baseball still likes to hold the equivalent of a dental convention to really grease the skids on dealmaking. Regardless, this is how it goes and, to add further excitement, this will be Chris Antonetti's first time drinking Long Island Iced Teas with Ed Wade or, at least, the first time he'll do so as the buck-stopper, the big cheese, the new Shapiro.
Despite his new status as Head GM In Charge, it initially seemed like Antonetti was not going to have a lot to do at the meetings. However, Hoynes reported yesterday that the Indians had been in on Javier Vazquez, Jon Garland and Aaron Harang. The targets left over since the Indians lost on those second-tier pitchers are less interesting, with Nick Punto and Josh Fields at the front of the line.
As is often the case wtih Cleveland, this offseason is exciting for its mystery. The Indians might do nothing but, more than likely, they'll do something and it will probably be at least a bit surprising. Cleveland's front office is always tight-lipped and, even when they're just being tight-lipped about signing Austin Kearns, there's some intrigue to that.
There's little point at guessing what low profile move Cleveland will make so, instead, I'll just express a desire:
Sign Manny.
Manny Ramirez, one of the best players in the history of the Cleveland Indians, is totally nuts. Buster Olney has floated that Manny might be so nuts that he'll only make $2-$3 million base salary. Here's what we know about Manny:
- He OPS'd 870 last year, which would've made him the second best hitter on the Indians.
- He's totally nuts, which means he might actually sign with Cleveland.
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I would be unequivocally, emotionally, cheeringly supportive of this move. You know who started 78 games for us in LF last year?….Trevor Crowe and Shelley Duncan. You know who started for us once at DH last year?…Mark Grudzielanek.
I mean, $3,000,000 bucks?? If he signs for less than $4,000,000 and the Tribe wasn’t in on it, I’ll be frustrated.
Opinions are scattered, though. Right now, more people think it is incredibly or marginally dumb than think it is CHAMPIONSHIP!
Can we agree it’s less dumb than Jeff flippin’ Francoeur?
by afh4 on Dec 6, 2010 12:29 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
I think we were all in agreement last month on this. I think there’s a productive 300 ABs to be had.
I would be very happy if we could sign Aaron Harang to a contract. This rotation could use another Veteran starter that has actually won some games. As far as Manny… if its less then 5 mil a year it is well worth it because if he has a fast start someone will come begging and give us decent prospects.
He got a 1 year 4 mil deal? I think the Tribe feel asleep at the wheel on that one, but that just me.
He’s from San Diego, and he signed with San Diego. He’s taking a one year deal, going home, staying in the NL, and pitching in the best pitcher’s park in either league. I think he was choosing that over any other offer for similar money, and the Indians were wise not to throw more than that at him.
That argument would be, disruptive of long-term development goals and pointless expenditure in a non-contending year.
by Jay on Dec 6, 2010 5:43 PM EST up reply actions
The development of Shelley Duncan and Travis Hafner?
by afh4 on Dec 6, 2010 5:45 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
And the money spent can be looked at as investment in the potential for a deadline trade for prospect(s). To be clear, we could easily sign Jeff Francour and hope he has a career few months and at a dirt cheap price, but it’s less likely than Manny putting up an OPS over .850. Yes, we then depend on a team in the need of a defense limited player, but hey, he’d look nice as a 4th outfielder in pinstripes in August.
Andrew asked what the argument against is, and I gave it. I’m not saying it’s the best argument.
by Jay on Dec 6, 2010 9:05 PM EST up reply actions
There was a team of that nature last season who acquired Manny
In the new Geico commercial, Marte sings "Let me be myself" on Wedge's front lawn (with the cavemen).
by V-Mart Shopper on Dec 8, 2010 2:59 AM EST up reply actions
The “character guys.”
In the new Geico commercial, Marte sings "Let me be myself" on Wedge's front lawn (with the cavemen).
by V-Mart Shopper on Dec 8, 2010 2:59 AM EST up reply actions
Who will be defiled by his clubhouse influence. (For the record, I voted for “smart.”)
In the new Geico commercial, Marte sings "Let me be myself" on Wedge's front lawn (with the cavemen).
by V-Mart Shopper on Dec 8, 2010 3:00 AM EST up reply actions
We could use this as a positive PR move. Wait- Dolan is still there. Nevermind. My most frustrating part of the last 3 seasons is how we have fallen to last in attendance. WTF?! We got to do something other than Snow Days this offseason, right? Right?!@?! Please…
Baseball fans are junkies, and their heroin is the statistic. - Robert S. Wieder
I don’t think Manny would sell anywhere near enough tickets to matter. People have blown tons of money on Cavs season tickets and people will always blow tons of money on the Browns. If you’re the 3rd sports team in Cleveland, you don’t seel tickets unless you’re awesome.
Hope the Cavs get relegated to 3rd sports team.
by Matt Y. on Dec 6, 2010 3:36 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think they’ll be there as soon as baseball starts up again.
"An intelligent man is sometimes forced to be drunk to spend time with his fools" -Hemingway
Yeah I think that the Indians have a shot at claiming 2nd sports team if they can start building some excitement in the next couple years.
Let’s face it, it won’t take much luck for them to claim first.
by Jay on Dec 6, 2010 9:06 PM EST up reply actions
After last Thursday, I think they’re already there.
by Ryan on Dec 6, 2010 8:12 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If only Wedge were still the manager and have to manage Manny. Think of the hillarity that would ensure…
The Tribe spent $9.3 million in signing bonuses in the draft last year, including $2.65 on Pomeranz. If they spend $4 million on Manny and are able to flip him for two good prospects, that seems like money well spent. However, I imagine that if Lance Berkman can get $8million to play the outfield, which he hasn’t done in a few years, I can’t imagine Manny could be had for much less.
When was the last time you heard anything described as “Lance being Lance”?
Manny has a built-in discount due to his um, eccentricities.
“Lance Being Lance” I would tend to interpret as a Lance Bass reference.
by Jay on Dec 6, 2010 5:44 PM EST up reply actions
For me, it’s someone getting killed by a medieval pole weapon.
by afh4 on Dec 6, 2010 5:46 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
There can be little dispute that a Manny signing has high potential upside in terms of a deadline deal. Especially if you can get him back on the juice.
by Jay on Dec 6, 2010 5:45 PM EST up reply actions
Didn’t Manny say last year that he called Thome and said that they both wanted to return to “where it started” and that he wants to sign with Cleveland as a result?
The Once and Future King
If Manny did that, which he may have, he probably immediately forgot about it.
by afh4 on Dec 6, 2010 6:58 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 4 recs
Ha. Yeah. I finally found the article that I remember reading. Dated April 13, 2009.
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4063800
The Once and Future King
Of all the inane things Manny has muttered, that’s the one you pick to take seriously?
Ye damned whale!
by elsandito on Dec 6, 2010 7:04 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
You know whats sad? It is the start of the Winter Meetings and we have to make-up our own rumors to get excited, which I am all for because the signing of Joe Smith and Jensen Lewis, don’t stir memories of Thome and Loften… more like the memories of Carlos Martinez and Candy Maldanado. It is very sad when the Royals and Pirates are mentioned as “in” on players more then the Tribe.
that’s because our FO doesn’t want other FOs to know when we’re “in” on guys.
I hold back at least 3 Ambriz jokes a week.
I don’t really want to be “in” on the guys the Pirates have been “in” on…
In the new Geico commercial, Marte sings "Let me be myself" on Wedge's front lawn (with the cavemen).
by V-Mart Shopper on Dec 8, 2010 3:03 AM EST up reply actions
The idea is not a bad one but the Indians could have pursued Omar Vizquel and Jim Thome who are even more loved in Cleveland then Manny and they didn’t pursue them at all. That’s why I don’t think they will touch Manny and he’s such a fruitcake at this point that he would be more of a burden and a distraction then a help.
That’s just bad logic.
Omar wasn’t brought back because Peralta was ready after his 2004 season in AAA, and after his 2005 monster “rookie” season (he only came up in 2002 when Omar got hurt) everyone and their mother, including Omar and his mother, knew the Indians made the right choice.
Thome wasn’t brought back because he became a free agent after the 2009 season. The Indians still had Hafner under contract for three more seasons. Both bat left handed, and neither can play the field. Not really sure where Thome fit into that picture?
The Indians supposedly did discuss Thome with the Phillies after the 2005 season, when the Phillies were dealing Thome to make room for Ryan Howard. He played only 52 games for Philly in 2005 due to back troubles, and everyone knew he was done as a first baseman. He’s started four (4! FOUR!) games at 1B since 2005. After Hafner’s 1.000OPS 2005 season, Cleveland didn’t really need a left-handed DH.
Yes, there is the matter of how a player fits into the roster. It’s rare to find a team where right-handed power wouldn’t be welcome, but it fits in especially well in the Indians’ present outfield/DH situation.
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