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Around SBN: How Will Spurs Respond to James Anderson's Trade Request?

Insert Laurel and Hardy Joke Here

With Hoynsie's latest twitterevelation, we've learned something we already knew: Jason Donald is a 3B candidate for the 2011 Tribe. Donald did not appear at third for the Indians last year, splitting 745 big league innings more or less right dow the middle of the keystone. This surprised me, as I had assumed he'd slid over there for at least a couple of late-game innings, if for no other reason than to keep Andy Marte off the field. I suppose Jayson Nix filled that role admirably, though. 

When I dug a little deeper (regular Carl Monday over here), though, I also figured out that Jason Donald didn't even play 3B in the minors last year. In fact, JD has played three games ever at third as a professional, all in Lehigh Valley in 2009. Donald's winter calisthenics over at the corner must be on the rudimentary level as he's legitimately having to learn the position, not simply polish unused skills back to a bright sheen. This makes my stomach churn a bit, as the aforementioned Mr. Nix proved, repeatedly, that up the middle skills sometimes don't translate smoothly to third base, at all, even a little bit. 

This appears to be one giant hedge, with the report on Donald's potential at third joining similar stories on both Nix and Cord Phelps, with Jared Goedert standing over next to the fence, shuffling his feet and looking down, hoping someone will notice he's the only one out of the bunch who's actually, you know, played 3B against live competition for more then a few games in a season.  Luis Valbuena's in the picture as well, but he was cropped out in post-production. 

To be fair, there is one experienced 3B in camp other than Goedert, in the personage of Jack Hannahan: NRI (couldn't that be some kind of cop show parody?). There's also rumblings that the Indians would consider Adam Everett: NRI (not the same ring, huh?) at the hot corner, but Everett's never played over there either and, at 33, this would really be asking the old dog from Austell, GA to learn some new tricks. To restate what you already know, neither of these guys can hit. That's how you earn a ":NRI" after your name. 

Star-divide

 

I could seize this opportunity to complain about Marte, again, or, more broadly, to point out that the Indians have been trying to find an acceptable defender at 3B since the Spanish-American War and yet are still doing these conversion projects with regularity or, even more broadly, go on a square-hole-round-peg rant. Honestly, though, I think the Indians are doing the best they can with the fresh-faced, cloying tripe they delivered themselves in the box labeled "3B Defense." One of these guys is going to have to play over there so you might as well make them all try it. I suspect all these guys could hit enough to carry 2B; we just have to hope one of them can figure out the nuances of Aaron Boone's old stomping grounds. 

In terms of what this army of third base dilettantes means for the rest of the team, two things should be noted. The first is that the only player you don't see mentioned above is Jason Kipnis. Perhaps this is obvious, but Kipnis is the future 2B and whether he walks out of spring training with that job or takes it over sometime next summer, it's clear that the Indians are making all their other middle infield planets orbit Kipnis' sun. His relatively quiet winter, made up of simply playing second and mashing winter league pitchers, is a tacit endorsement of his stranglehold on the position. 

The second overarching theme I detect is that, as fun as it might be to read the tea leaves, the Cleveland front office does not have a preconceived plan heading into Spring Training. It's tempting to think that the report on Donald today somehow preempts the earlier reports on Nix and Phelps but, with just a couple of moments to recompose oneself, it becomes obvious that the Indians only real plan is to let these guys arrive in Goodyear and then hope that either one of them is really good or that, if they're all really bad, ????. Frankly, it's sort of a palms up, "Well, what the hell else would you suggest?" moment that's appropriate of 2011, a season that will almost certainly be over, from a competitive sense, as soon as it begins. 

Poll
Who will play the most innings at 3B for the Indians in 2011?
Jason Donald
42 votes
Adam Everett
13 votes
Jack Hannahan
16 votes
Cord Phelps
35 votes
Jayson Nix
71 votes
Jared Goedert
33 votes
Other?
49 votes
Luis Valbuena
6 votes

265 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 45 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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Comments

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As I said a couple days ago, the inability to come up with any reasonable one-year fill-in at 3B this winter has to be the Tribe’s biggest off-season failure. I’m afraid we are going to wishing for last year’s .248/.307/.393 line from 3B, while exceeding last year’s 27 errors and not getting close to the .943 fielding percentage at the spot.

by APV on Jan 18, 2011 12:19 PM EST reply actions  

It is also worth looking back at what Ryan said about 3B in October. Not good.

by APV on Jan 18, 2011 12:31 PM EST up reply actions  

It seems like the Tribe could set the floor for the position with Hannahan if they are so inclined. With decent offensive numbers in AAA last year, it seems reasonable to assume he could put up a season similar to his 2008 in Oakland where his borderline outstanding defense made up for subpar offense. I also have to wonder what sort of a multiplier effect there would be with someone like him playing d at the hot corner, especially for guys like Masterson and Carmona.

I just don’t know if it’d be worth stealing at bats from the young guys.

by TKilbane on Jan 18, 2011 12:56 PM EST up reply actions  

Hannahan certainly appears to be the best bet defensively, but it is hard to imagine him not being an offensive hole. And as you point out, playing Hannahan would come at the cost of one of the younger guys who could possibly (?) turn into something of value. At the very least, maybe he and Everett can lead some defensive drills during spring training.

by APV on Jan 18, 2011 1:04 PM EST up reply actions  

It says something about the offseason when three of the main authors have posted on the thrilling non-race to the 3B crown.

by afh4 on Jan 18, 2011 1:46 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t see it that way. I would think they would look at the 2B glut and say, why pay to bring in a mediocre 3B when we have plenty of 2B candidates who can play a mediocre 3B, and get valuable reps in so doing?

by Jay on Jan 18, 2011 2:39 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t know. I guess I see the 2011 situation as an opportunity to use each roster spot in one of two ways (or both, actually). Either put a guy in place who has a chance to develop into an important part of the future at that position, or put a guy who can in some way provide good production. I don’t see retrofitting one of our B/C grade 2B prospects into third base as fitting that goal. I’ll happily be wrong, though.

by APV on Jan 18, 2011 3:00 PM EST up reply actions  

If every prospect and young player plays up to his potential, we eventually end up with Donald and Phelps as our bench guys. I can’t complain about giving them reps at 3B, because we can’t really know which guys will pan out and which guys won’t.

by Jay on Jan 18, 2011 4:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Abbott and Costello?

You didn't get me down, Ray.

by elsandito on Jan 18, 2011 12:30 PM EST reply actions  

Oh. Whoops.

Can’t decide if I should change it. Seems sort of dishonest and, perhaps, it’s just as dumb either way.

by afh4 on Jan 18, 2011 1:45 PM EST up reply actions  

No. Laurel & Hardy’s routine “Replacement Player’s on Third” was hilarious, albeit obscure.

by emd2k3 on Jan 18, 2011 4:54 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

I have it on good authority Jack Hannahan is going to be featured in the remake.

Though I look right at home, I still feel like an exile

by Manhattan Tribe Fan on Jan 18, 2011 7:49 PM EST up reply actions  

Pretty diverse set of responses in the poll. Anybody on the “Other?” train want to specify?

by afh4 on Jan 18, 2011 1:44 PM EST reply actions  

I was in the “other” vote category, though I don’t have much of an “other” in mind. I don’t like the fact that of all the above listed, only Jack Hannahan is actually a third baseman. And his offense is atrocious.

by APV on Jan 18, 2011 1:54 PM EST up reply actions  

Forced to name a name, maybe I’d go with Joe Crede on a minor league contract

by APV on Jan 18, 2011 1:58 PM EST up reply actions  

And now I see Crede signed a minor league deal with the Rockies.

This off-season sucks.

by APV on Jan 19, 2011 4:48 PM EST up reply actions  

I think it’ll be Nix. He plays to two of the Indians compulsions: finding value in retreads and suppressing arb clocks.

by afh4 on Jan 18, 2011 1:59 PM EST up reply actions  

I would rather see Nix in a utility role, with Donald starting at 2B and Phelps playing an everyday utility position in Columbus. Hopefully by the end of July it won’t matter anyway, and the Kipnis/Chisenhall extravaganza will migrate north from Columbus to Cleveland.

by APV on Jan 18, 2011 2:03 PM EST up reply actions  

My impression is that they are not keen on Chiz arriving this year. Goldstein put his ETA at “late 2011.”

If you think they’ll make a move for a 3B, will it be before or after this explodes?

by afh4 on Jan 18, 2011 2:06 PM EST up reply actions  

I agree that I think it is doubtful we would see either Chiz or Kipnis before September…but it would be nice if they made those two forced Cleveland’s hands a bit by playing through the roof.

Unless they can get a guy like Crede on a non-guaranteed minor league contract, my guess is they do nothing and go with what they have. The quotes from Antonetti and Shapiro of late have been incredibly depressing in terms of how they describe “operating within certain constraints and limits.” Sounds like they have been told to spend nothing until the position of the organization improves. If they add no one, I guess my vote is for the Jason/Jayson duo at 2B/3B, with either one of the NRI’s or Valbuena as the utility guy.

by APV on Jan 18, 2011 2:16 PM EST up reply actions  

How improbable is it that the thinking has changed on Chiz at least? That assuming a reasonable progression, once the service time hurdle is cleared in June, the F.O. expects to promote him? That would explain the lack of urgency this offseason- why sweat a 10 week problem?

Of course, since when do things go as planned with this franchise, especially regarding young talent?

by spreidel on Jan 18, 2011 11:35 PM EST up reply actions  

Chisenhall is a great prospect, but his numbers don’t scream “promote now,” and the Indians don’t tend to move aggressively on promotions. You might say that his Progress Score is more impressive than his Net. His walk rate was adequate at best, and that matters.

There is little reason to think that the Chiz will dominate so thoroughly in 10 weeks at Triple-A, at age 22, that the Indians will feel there’s no more point keeping him there. There’s no reason to expect it, and even less reason to think the Indians would actually be planning around such an expectation.

Do I think it’s possible that Chisenhall will play so well this season that he’ll effectively move up his own clock by a full year? Sure, it’s a significant possibility. But it’s not likely.

by Jay on Jan 19, 2011 4:29 PM EST up reply actions  

This sounds like the best situation. So by default they can use Hannahan there I guess, or really any defensive first guy would be fine.

It would be nice if Donald all of the sudden started hitting like a league avg. 2B for the first half of the year with decent defense and turned into a somewhat valuable trade chip (with a great deal of the value in his service time being where it is). I know it’s risky to not play for depth (that is developing Donald into a decent utility player to have behind Kipinis, AsCab, and Chiz) but well damn it! I want them to increase value of these guys on the open market, utility infielders are not a difficulty group to find, and move Donald to a team where he can be a regular 2B while also bolstering one of the many weak areas on this team.

by hans on Jan 18, 2011 5:15 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m not happy to see the Indians trying to play all these guys anywhere but their natural position. It’s like we can’t leave well enough alone, so we have to ruin what we do have, hoping to get lucky.

by 9James on Jan 18, 2011 2:38 PM EST reply actions  

Yeah, I’d hate to see Jayson Nix’s otherwise promising career go down the toilet because the Tribe couldn’t stop tinkering.

Come on, four billion!

by Joel D on Jan 18, 2011 8:19 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

The Department of Analytics has proposed returning Choo to pitching duties.

by odradek on Jan 21, 2011 12:46 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I just can’t for the life of me care who plays there this year. I’ll root for whoever puts on the suit.

by madherb on Jan 18, 2011 4:37 PM EST reply actions  

77 votes in and our top vote-getter isn’t even topping 24%, not even double the no confidence vote. Awesome.

by APV on Jan 18, 2011 5:36 PM EST reply actions  

And at 100 votes even, Jayson Nix (21) holds off late charges from Cord Phelps (20) and Other (18). Meanwhile Jared Goedert (15) surges ahead of Jason Donald (13) for 4th.

by APV on Jan 18, 2011 8:59 PM EST up reply actions  

Donald (16 votes) has crushed Goedert (2) and Phelps (6) over the last 50 votes to move into 2nd—which is where he’ll be playing.

by YoDaddyWags on Jan 19, 2011 5:06 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m still waiting for Corey Smith to figure it out.

by xrickx on Jan 19, 2011 1:18 AM EST reply actions  

Jesus, going on 29 and he has only managed 12 games above AA across 11 seasons and 6 organizations. Is he going for the AA home run record or something?

by The Grimace on Jan 19, 2011 1:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Weren’t we looking at a third baseman named Godot a little while ago?

"Magic would be getting productivity out of Crowe or Valbuena. I’ll admit we could use a little luck, but that’s not the same thing." - Jay

by woodsmeister on Jan 19, 2011 5:53 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m just trying to figure out why people voted for Valbuena.

I just want to believe.

by mjmarble on Jan 19, 2011 1:38 PM EST reply actions  

Valbuena is kind of the “everybody else fails” option.

by Jay on Jan 19, 2011 4:30 PM EST up reply actions  

I thought “Other?” filled that role.

Come on, four billion!

by Joel D on Jan 19, 2011 10:57 PM EST up reply actions  

Luis Valbuena will be the Indians’ comeback player of the year in 2011.

by odradek on Jan 21, 2011 12:47 AM EST up reply actions  

Pittsburgh has a 27 year old one former uber prospect that OPS’d 963 in AAA as recently as 2009 and has since languished on the MLB bench. He has the rep for a good glove and he’s cheap. He would be the perfect short-term solution.

by stuart dean on Jan 22, 2011 9:15 AM EST reply actions  

I like to pretend he doesn’t exist anymore.

by hyphens on Jan 24, 2011 8:51 PM EST up reply actions  

oooooo do tell, do tell … /sarc

by talonk on Jan 27, 2011 2:21 AM EST up reply actions  

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