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Tribe All-Stars

by mkwng on Jul 1, 2007 6:17 PM EDT Comment 63 comments

Your 2007 Tribe All-Stars are:

Victor Martinez
Grady Sizemore
(both selected as reserves)
CC Sabathia

Three deserving picks, for sure. They never take set-up men, but if they did, Betancourt should go.

Here are the rest of the AL starters and reserves. Discuss your snubs and surprises below.

0 recs | Comment 63 comments

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Comments

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Note that other than every-team-gets-a-rep selections, Leyland only had two spots to fill. He used them on Johan and Victor. Hard to argue with that.

by Jay on Jul 1, 2007 6:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Also, I was just watching Buster Olney (currently climbing my Idiot Standings) discussing the selections on ESPN. He complained at length that Sammy Sosa wasn't included, on the basis of his being "the Rangers best player."

Mentioned Sosa's .255 average and 14 home runs (both subpar for RF) and of course his 63 RBI. Left out the part where Sosa is 44th in the AL in OPS. Or pick your own non-idiot stat to use.

by Jay on Jul 1, 2007 6:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

I feel like elaborating ... Sosa's OPS is third on his own team, behind Teixeira and Lofton (!) and his numbers at the plate are almost identical to the Rangers's second baseman, Ian Kinsler.

by Jay on Jul 1, 2007 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

However, neither Lofton nor Texiera was the choice, Michael Young was, so he may have a complaint about the Rangers representative, although his solution may not have been correct. I don't mind Buster Olney. Actually, TBS could really use someone like him. Gwynn and Ripken are a little stiff in the studio.

by Fundamentals on Jul 1, 2007 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Kinsler
14HR 35RBI 35BB 45K's BA.241 OBP.334 SLG .452
Sosa
14HR 63RBI 21BB 75K's BA .255 OBP.309 SLG .479

You are correct their numbers are very similar except one major glaring difference, I will give you a guess what it is.

Champion of the Kelly Shoppach for Catcher and Franklin Gutiérrez for Right Fielder campaigns.

by E5 on Jul 1, 2007 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Right, the OBP.

Kinsler's is mediocre (but not awful) for a 2B.

Sosa's is totally unacceptable for a RF.

by Jay on Jul 1, 2007 7:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

RBIs are a stat that doesn't show much. Kinsler would have more if he wasn't batting 2nd (against lefties) or 9th (against righties).

"The hibachi is coming to a city near you. I'm cooking chicken and shrimp, but if you want to throw a double team my way, filet mignon gets cooked too"

by Rayman on Jul 1, 2007 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Kinsler 11 SB
Sosa 0 SB

I'd take Kinsler too, which I have on my fantasy team. He'll have a nice second half as he has been pretty unlucky in the past month and a half.

by hans on Jul 1, 2007 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

So Leyland had nothing to do with Sizemore making it over Granderson? That's the players' vote?

by cheech99 on Jul 1, 2007 6:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

CC makes it... but does he start? Dan Haren will be on two days rest (I believe, didn't double check the BBTN guys). Majority picked Haren to edge out CC for the nod. Beckett not even mentioned.

by CarnegieAndOntario on Jul 1, 2007 6:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

This puts another smile on my face. I was really worried one of Grady or Victor was going to be let off.

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 1, 2007 6:55 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Who wants to bet that Okajima wins the final vote?

- Jake

by jakesinger777 on Jul 1, 2007 7:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Yeah, I bet he does.

"The hibachi is coming to a city near you. I'm cooking chicken and shrimp, but if you want to throw a double team my way, filet mignon gets cooked too"

by Rayman on Jul 1, 2007 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

One of these days, they'll put two Japanese guys on the ballot. (That's how they got a white mayor in Baltimore on The Wire.)

by Jay on Jul 1, 2007 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Carcetti for Mayor

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 1, 2007 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

My buddy jasonmd was at his victory party.

by Jay on Jul 1, 2007 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

For real?

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 1, 2007 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

I'm watching on DVD, so I haven't gotten to S4 yet. In fact, I just wound up S3 last night.

by mkwng on Jul 1, 2007 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Just keeps getting better and better. After my wife and I finished s4 it was hard to get back to watching anything else. IMHO, best tv show out there. Can't wait for s5, except for that fact that it will be the last.

by haymister on Jul 1, 2007 8:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

It gets better with each season. Though 2-3 are pretty close for me, and 1 is the weakest. 4's the best I think (until 5 comes out).

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 1, 2007 9:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

It's got to be Season 3. The "hamsterdam" experiment was such an ambitious storyline -- a totally outlandish development in a show that's painfully true-to-life. You'd think it would be impossible to pull off without breaking the realism, but it was just masterfully executed. Just amazing.

Yes, Jason really is at the victory party, warmly greeting and congratulating Carcetti and his wife, only for a few seconds but very clearly him nonetheless. He has a SAG card from some years back, and he ended up being an extra on the shoot as a lark.

by Jay on Jul 1, 2007 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Colvin is a brilliant character, extremely underrated.

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 2, 2007 2:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Let's see...Boston player, from Japan, yeah, the other guys don't have a chance.

by Ryan on Jul 1, 2007 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

I feel the AL did alot better than the NL. The NL roster has 6 closers on it, along with Cole Hamels who shouldn't be there. A bunch of deserving starters were left out, along with the 3 other elite shortstops.

"The hibachi is coming to a city near you. I'm cooking chicken and shrimp, but if you want to throw a double team my way, filet mignon gets cooked too"

by Rayman on Jul 1, 2007 7:19 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Cole Hamels should definitely be there.

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 1, 2007 7:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

29 BB, 116 Ks in 111.2 IP.

by nickjs21 on Jul 1, 2007 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

He's 40th in the league in ERA. Aaron Harang has almost the same stats as him, and he's not on the team.

Chris Young - 2.14(!)ERA, 96 IP, 90K/36BB
Derek Lowe - 3.03 ERA, 115 IP, 81K/35BB
Brandon Webb - 3.05 ERA, 118 IP, 100K/42BB

One of those three should have been picked ahead of Hamels. You could even throw in Ian Snell, Tim Hudson, and John Maine as possibles.

"The hibachi is coming to a city near you. I'm cooking chicken and shrimp, but if you want to throw a double team my way, filet mignon gets cooked too"

by Rayman on Jul 1, 2007 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

None of those guys have Hamels's K/BB. I'm usually a Webb fan but his walk rates have spiked dramatically this year.

by Joe. on Jul 1, 2007 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Young's ERA is 1.70 runs less than Hamels'. Hamels' K/BB is great. But should that be enough to cover his high ERA (relative to others, of course)?

Hamels is an all-star quality pitcher, but he should NOT be there in place of Chris Young, John Maine, etc.

"The hibachi is coming to a city near you. I'm cooking chicken and shrimp, but if you want to throw a double team my way, filet mignon gets cooked too"

by Rayman on Jul 1, 2007 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

To be honest, I would judge a pitcher by his K/BB before I'd judge him by his ERA.

by nickjs21 on Jul 1, 2007 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Webb's GB% 60.9% (third best in the NL) where-as Hamels is at 39.3%. Webb has been walking guys more than usual, but he's the type of guy we hope Fausto can turn into, a guy who can strike out 7 plus per 9 and cause 60.9% GB. He's been the better pitcher if you look at Pitching Runs Created by 6 runs. None of this matters when it comes to picking guys for the all star game though, as it usually comes down to W-L record, ERA, and then maybe Ks.

by hans on Jul 1, 2007 10:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

It would take a minor miracle for Fausto to become a Webb like pitcher. I like the guy and I am sure he will improve but Webb is a yearly Cy Young candidate.

Champion of the Kelly Shoppach for Catcher and Franklin Gutiérrez for Right Fielder campaigns.

by E5 on Jul 1, 2007 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

I'll give you that Fausto probably won't K as many as Webb,, But he can improve his current K rate, unlike a guy like Westbrook who can put up the same GB% that Fausto can, Fausto can throw hard, we've seen him throw mid nineties before, and he's only 23. Wang is probably a better comparison than Webb, but I lump them all in the same class of pitcher. An
extreme GB pitcher can have a pretty good career.

by hans on Jul 1, 2007 10:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Gammons just said that Betancourt was on the Final Vote ... but I see Kelvim Escobar.

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 1, 2007 7:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

I would have voted for Bonderman or Escobar, anyway.

by nickjs21 on Jul 1, 2007 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Interesting. ESPN has had a few mistakes on the All-Star team, I'm wondering if there weren't some late changes. Gammons and Ravech each just said that Rafael Betancourt was on the final five to vote in, and according to TBS and mlb.com's actual vote, he is not. This is after ESPN earlier said that Aaron Hill was an AL reserve.

by Fundamentals on Jul 1, 2007 7:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Not a bad team for the AL... the only egregious error I think is Rodriguez starting at catcher. Other that that, I'd rather see Cabrera or Guillen starting at short over Jeter, but it's hard to argue with our selections.

Now the Lord can make you tumble, and the Lord can make you turn, and the Lord can make you overflow... but the Lord can't make you burn

by Turkmenbashi on Jul 1, 2007 7:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Kruk picks CC to start for the AL

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 1, 2007 7:36 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

As did Eric Young

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 1, 2007 7:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Phillips picks Haren

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 1, 2007 7:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

I could honestly not care less what John Kruk, Eric Young, and Steve Phillips think about who should start the All-Star Game. If you added Tim McCarver to that panel, it would officially be the least amount of weight any collective opinion held with me.

That being said, it's an All-Star game. It doesn't matter who starts. They all pitch the same amount of innings.

by nickjs21 on Jul 1, 2007 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Of course, they don't mention any stats besides wins and ERA. But they do talk about how the pitchers "look on the mound", which we all know is very important. These guys are morons.

by Buckeye Brad on Jul 1, 2007 7:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

They follow up their brilliance with a big Sammy love fest. Hit or miss I suppose

by Gradyforpresident on Jul 1, 2007 7:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

+5

by NickFantana on Jul 1, 2007 8:22 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

unfrozencaveman?

by Cory Snyder on Jul 1, 2007 9:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

CC will pitch Thursday afternoon in Detroit, and his next start would be the following Tuesday, which happens to be the date of the All-Star game. The Tribe gets an extended all-star break, with their first post-break game coming on Friday vs. KC. Supposing CC throws two innings in San Francisco (whether as the starter or not); when does he next pitch for the Tribe? Would he be ready on two days' rest to pitch on Friday? Would it matter if he only goes one inning in the Midsummer Classic?

I'm happy for all of our (all-)stars, but quite frankly I want CC pitching for the Tribe and not the AL. If pitching Tuesday pushes him back a day or two in the rotation, I'd rather he not pitch on Tuesday, or at least pitch as little as possible.

by Fiddlesticks on Jul 1, 2007 9:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

put me in the camp that thinks the All-Star game is a completely pointless waste of time.

but CC getting to start the game right across the Bay from his hometown, in front of a bajillion people... well, that's kinda neat. i hope he throws 16 pitches in two perfect innings and enjoys the rest of the game from the comfort of the bench.

by nctribefan on Jul 1, 2007 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

I'll care about the All Star game once they take the vote out of the fans hands. It's a completely pointless popularity contest and a half-assed game.

by Toxicadam on Jul 1, 2007 9:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

the entire point of the all-star game is to entertain fans. it actually does an even worse job of that if you take the vote away from them.

by nctribefan on Jul 1, 2007 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

The fans don't necessarily really know what they fans are going to enjoy.

by Jay on Jul 1, 2007 11:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Enlightened absolutism comes to baseball.

by nickjs21 on Jul 1, 2007 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

All-Star's picked by an enlightened dictator. It works in Venezuela.

by Toxicadam on Jul 2, 2007 12:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

"Hello Cleveland! We're Enlightened Dictator and we're here to rock you! You will be rocked! If you are not rocked, arena security will ensure that you are rocked."

Pronk Needs You

by woodsmeister on Jul 2, 2007 8:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Absolutely hyserical. Great post.

God truly does hate cleveland sports.

by Gradysmanldy on Jul 2, 2007 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Aw, c'mon its always fun. Decades of seeing the stars come play together on one Summer night where the game is celebrated. Just enjoy it!

True, the derby has become tiresome and the WS home field is bogus, but its a true baseball tradition.

by DixonCayne on Jul 1, 2007 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

I love the All-Star game, but I think some of it is my age. When I was a kid, you saw the AL East competition pretty regularly, the AL West competition occasionally (when the games weren't past bedtime), and otherwise, it was Game Of The Week or the occasional Monday Night Baseball. There was This Week In Baseball and 4 minutes on the local news for highlights. So the All-Star game was a pretty big deal. And unlike the NBA, NHL, and NFL, it really is more than a glorified exhibition.

So I still look forward to it every year.

by mkwng on Jul 1, 2007 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Amen!

Sometimes you just gotta be lucky

by mauichuck on Jul 2, 2007 8:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

The question then becomes...who determines the starters if not the fans?

The process has its flaws, but with the advent of Internet voting, it's much less likely to be unduly influenced by hometown ballot stuffing, like it was with Cincinnati in the 1970s and Cleveland in the 1990s.

by Ryan on Jul 2, 2007 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

The players, the BBWAA, the coaches, a combination of all of them? I'd prefer those to fan voting. And online balloting just allows international fans to stuff the ballot for a) international players, b) Yankees and Red Sox players (because they recognize them).

Imagine if the fans had a Hall of Fame vote. It would matter less and less as the years went on ... kind of like the All-Star Game. And Cooperstown is just as much for the fans to enjoy (they buy tickets) as All-Star Game festivities.

by nickjs21 on Jul 2, 2007 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

I know the sentiment you're driving at but none of those groups do a particularly good job of choosing the things they're allowed to choose. Especially the BBWA.

by afh4 on Jul 2, 2007 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

The writers have their own "methods" of voting (see MVP, HOF, etc).

I don't really see the tragedy in letting the fans pick the starters, the players pick some reserves, and the managers fill out the rest of the roster. And I say this knowing that Travis Hafner has been jobbed off of at least two All-Star teams.

The only thing I'd change about the process is to always have the DH, even if the game is in an NL park. To fill out the NL DH, just include the position player who got the most votes as a runner-up.

by Ryan on Jul 2, 2007 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

Agreed on the always-DH rule ... and the players' runner-up slots should be replaced by more manager slots.

Even if you didn't use the DH every year, the fans should still get to vote on a DH for the AL in addition to the 1B. It would make a lot more sense, even if he's just a reserve. It would be rare for any DH to be elected who wasn't at least a decent choice for the team.

by Jay on Jul 3, 2007 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Tribe All-Stars

[deleted various posts, personal attacks/baiting]

Come on guys, you're better than this.

by Ryan on Jul 2, 2007 6:32 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

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