Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Monday: Indians 6, Tigers 5 (11 Innings)
Tuesday: Indians 7, Tigers 4
Wednesday: Indians 4, Tigers 2
With today's win, the Indians didn't officially clinch the AL Division, but with ten games to play and a 7.5 game lead on the Tigers, it's just matter of when, not if.
Think about this for a moment: Just over a month ago (August 16th), the Indians weren't even in first place, and they may clinch the division with a week to spare. They are now tied with the Angels for the best record in baseball. They've gained 8 games in the division standings in 33 days.
Things have gone right for the Indians, most notably the relative health of the club. Detroit's two key setup men, Fernando Rodney and Joel Zumaya, spent much of the season on the Disabled List. Zumaya gave up the key hit of the series on Monday, a game-tying home run off the bat of Jhonny Peralta. David Dellucci was the only position player to lose any appreciable time to injury, while Gary Sheffield was on and off the DL all season, and still isn't 100%.
But the Indians also had bad surprises in 2007, most notably the ineffectiveness of two of their starters (Cliff Lee and Jeremy Sowers), and a first-half DL stint to a third. Of the four free agents they signed for their bullpen, one (Keith Foulke) retired before the season started, one (Roberto Hernandez) was released a couple months into the season, and a third (Aaron Fultz) has been little more than a mopup man down the stretch. Josh Barfield, who was supposed to be the Indians' everyday second baseman, hit .246/.273/.326 and is currently useful only as a pinch runner. Andy Marte didn't even make it to Memorial Day.
Marte's replacement, Casey Blake, won Friday's game with a home run. Jensen Lewis, who made his MLB debut just two months ago, pitched three high-leverage innings yesterday, allowing one baserunner. Asdrubal Cabrera, who was on the prospect radar but generally thought too young to be of any service this year, scored the first run on Monday and made an impressive defensive play to help finish the game today.
You'll notice thus far that I've said nothing about Leyland's wizened wisdom, or Eric Wedge's nervous tics. Of course the convenient narrative would be that Wedge learned the secret art of fundamentals and clubhouse tirades. Moving on...
When you're facing the second-best offense in baseball, having good starting pitching is going to be crucial. The first two games of the series featured two yeoman-like efforts by Indian starters. Paul Byrd gave up 5 early runs (not entirely his fault), but stuck long enough to have the bullpen set up for extra innings. Jake Westbrook had nothing as far as stuff was concerned, yet toughed it out for five innings. Neither got wins for their effort, but they played pivotal parts the victories. CC Sabathia pitched a strong seven innings today, and won his 18th (important for Cy Young voters, not so much for us).
The bullpen was even better than their usual selves, holding the Tigers scoreless over the course of the series. This included seven scoreless innings on Monday. And this came without Rafael Perez making a single appearance.
The Indians offense made the most of their opportunities, hitting eight home runs, four off Tigers ace Justin Verlander in Tuesday's win. The offense wasn't clicking, but took advantage of enough mistakes to stay in and finally win games.
The magic number is now 3, and with any luck, the Indians should leave Cleveland with a division flag hanging at the Jake.
Next Up: The first game of the rest of the season. Carmona vs. Blanton, 7:05 PM.
65 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
p.s: Barfied, of the Maybin school of baserunning, seems to be making himself less useful even as a baserunner.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
QFT.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
here's to having the tribe clinch before then.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
On other things. How does the tribe set up their playoff rotation? Do they skip days before Sabathia and Carmona's (after tomorrows) next start? They will not be in line to start games 1 and 2 unless they go on short rest before that, and that does not seem to be a good idea. Anyway, they will not be on their usual 5-6 days the next week and a half. I expect that Lee will get a start to make up the gaps.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Perhaps ESPN should consider this!
ESPN, with all their raving about the Yankees being the hottest team and just steamrolling up the standings, obviously missed this:
In the month of September:
NYY: 13-4
CLE: 13-5
Last 25 games:
NYY: 17-8
CLE: 20-5
NYY: 4 games vs. DET (above .500)
3 games vs. BOS (above .500)
3 games vs. TB (below .500)
3 games vs. SEA (above .500)
3 games vs. KC (below .500)
3 games vs. TOR (around .500)
3 games vs. BOS (above .500)
3 games vs. BAL (below .500)
9 games vs. below .500 teams (7-2)
3 games vs. around .500 teams (2-1)
10 games vs. above .500 teams (6-4)
CLE: 6 games vs. CHW (below .500)
7 games vs. MIN (around .500)
1 game vs. SEA (above .500)
4 games vs. LAA (above .500)
3 games vs. KC (below .500)
3 games vs. DET (above .500)
9 games vs. below .500 teams (6-3)
7 games vs. around .500 teams (7-0)
8 games vs. above .500 teams (6-2)
Seems to me the Indians have pretty much matched the Yankees, if not outdone them by a slim margin due to the fact that we faced Minnesota, a .500 team, 7 times, including Johan twice, versus the Yankees facing the Blue Jays, another .500 team, just 3 times, and they didn't face Halladay and lost the one game in which Burnett started in that series. Plus, we swept the around .500 team (Minnesota) and have a better winning percentage against the above .500 teams, while the Yankees mostly feasted on the below .500 teams, the quality of which they WON'T be facing in the postseason.
So, the Yankees may not be QUITE as good as ESPN and others are believing - you're supposed to beat the cupcakes, but you don't face cupcakes in the postseason. Analyzing how ones have done against quality competition, especially against ones you'll see in the postseason, likely would tell more about how good a ballclub is really doing. That's why I like our chances. :-)
Just something to think about when it comes to ESPN's propaganda regarding the Yankees' hot streak.
Re: Perhaps ESPN should consider this!
by Seattle Tribe Fan on Sep 20, 2007 10:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Re: Perhaps ESPN should consider this!
The Yankees have won 44 games by blowout (5+ or more runs). The Indians only 25.
They are a very dangerous team .. and have been so for 4 months straight now. We actually had a 6 week period where we were fortunate to be .500 (because of our incredible pitching).
Re: Perhaps ESPN should consider this!
The Yankees had a ten-week period where they were under .500. Both teams have put their dry spells pretty convincingly behind them.
The Indians are plenty dangerous. Ask the Tigers. Ask the Twins.
I'm not saying they're not dangerous, but
Plus, as I showed in my post above, we've faced better competition over that same stretch the media talks about (the last 25 or so) and we've posted a better record. And like I also said, it's not so much if you can beat the cupcakes; can you beat the quality competition, and in the recent stretch, the Indians have matched or outdone the Yankees in that category, against tougher pitching. We've beaten Johan twice and Verlander twice in the last month, while the Yankees didn't beat Burnett or Beckett, nor faced Halladay.
Essentially, as Jay put it, we are just as tough as the Yankees are, with better pitching, and usually, better pitching is what leads to victories in October, not better hitting. The '95 Indians had as good of an offensive club as this Yankees' team does, yet did they tattoo Greg Maddux or Tom Glavine? No. Sabathia and Carmona both throw harder than those two and have comparable stuff to those two, which is why I think the Yankees won't be scoring that many runs off these two, whereas I think our offense is capable of scoring 4-5 runs off any of the Yankees starters.
In fact, wasn't one of the main complaints against the 90's Indians the fact we lacked a dominant ace? Well, by my count, this 2007 edition has not 1, but 2, dominant aces. Also by my count, the Yankees have essentially zero. In my opinion, Pettitte/Clemens/Mussina remind me very much of Orel Hershiser and Dennis Martinez - quality veterans who are past their primes. They can still deliver quality outings, but can't be counted on consistently to put up the dominant starts they were once able to do with regularity, much like Hershiser and Martinez in the mid-90s.
Combine that with a Mariano Rivera who hasn't been the same dominant closer he's been in the past (good, certainly, but not where you think the game is automatically over when he comes into the game - he nearly blew the lead against Baltimore on Wednesday, luckily able to strike out Scott Moore, who has limited ML experience, on an outside strike call with the bases loaded) and I think the Indians have at least a solid shot of defeating the Yankees in the postseason.
The national media and many still think the Yankees have that invincible aura from past Octobers, but that hasn't helped them go all the way the past 6 seasons. Plus, the Yankees haven't gotten out of the first round the past two years, to both the Angels (who have not been mystified by the so-called Yankee mystique) and the Tigers (who had no recent playoff history success against the Yankees, yet defeated them in 3 straight games after losing Game 1 if I remember correctly.)
So, I'm not saying the Yankees aren't dangerous, but all this national media talk about the Yankees being the hottest team is incorrect, nor are they without their weaknesses, just like all the postseason participants have their strengths and weaknesses.
Just my 2 cents - no offense.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
I don't know about Lee, as he's not "stretched out" to start. But Sowers and Laffey will definitely get a start in there somewhere...
My bet is that it'll become a lot clearer by Monday.
by paul sorrento to cooperstown on Sep 20, 2007 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Anyway, I think it depends on how much Wedge wants to invest in trying to get a top seed. I would love to run our two studs out there at home in the first two games. But it is also important to have them set up, regardless of where they are pitching.
Adding to the confusion is that we won't know until the very end which starting date we will have for the ALDS. That's true, of course, for everyone.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
That said, who would we rather face?
Boston's pitching has clearly been the class of the AL all season, though they've struggled some of late. Beckett will be tough, Schilling has looked pedestrian, Dice-K is a giant question mark, and Wakefield is his usual junk balling self (a terrifying thought assuming he starts instead of Matsuzaka).
New York has obviously been going through starters the way the Tribe went through relievers last year, but their rotation has settled down of late. Wang is another soft tosser, Pettite and Clemens have the postseason experience and are scary in a short series, and Mussina has looked better as of late (though I'd expect we'd see him in long relief).
As of now, I'd rather see the BoSox (the season series with NYY scares me), but I'm curious what others think.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
YEAR Home/Away
2007 4.06/4.83
2006 2.88/5.40
2005 4.31/4.66
2004 2.37/4.34 [first season where Jake started the season in the rotation]
04-06 3.22/4.70
Then again, anything can happen in the playoffs! But I do like the idea of lining up all the little match ups in one's favor and letting the results play out.
I don't it matters whether we pitch C.C or Carmona in NYY or BOS or the moon. Their Home/Away splits don't reveal much. Although Byrd's Home/Away splits for this season and 2006 suggest that he could benefit from pitching on the road.
In the end, I just want a rested and hungry rotation going right at the Yanks throat. I think they would have an advantage over us in the longer series (7 games) because we'd have to get 3 starts from Byrd and Westbrook. However, in the ALDS (8-day affair), they'd have to face C.C and Carmona 4 times. I don't care how good their offense is, facing our guys guys ain't no picnic.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/schedule/ps_07.jsp
Unless they go with Westbrook over Byrd as a 3rd starter, but - again - I can't see that happening.
by paul sorrento to cooperstown on Sep 20, 2007 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Today's debate on Mike and the Mad Dog on WFAN in New York was who will be the #4 starter in the Yankee's post-season rotation, Hughes, Kennedy or Mussina.
They figure it's Wang, Pettite and Clemens as the first three. Matching either Byrd or Westbrook against The Rocket is a winnable affair for the Indians.
I see no way Cleveland could enter game 4 of a seven game series against the Evil Empire any worse than up 2-1. That leaves us with the later of the Byrd-Westbrook combo for one of those three yahoo's. I'll take that, especially with C.C. and Fausto around the corner.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
by fleerdon on Sep 20, 2007 6:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
by Fiddlesticks on Sep 20, 2007 6:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
What know-nothing bullshit. What passes for anaylsis and knowledge in Bristol is criminal.
I had Cleveland penciled in to win the Central with at least 93 wins in April. I'm just surprised that after June and July, they've been able to pull off a hell of a run to get to 90.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
That's why ESPN will always be crap .. now they use Sportscenter and BBTN as a hype machine to sell their "product".
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
by Turkmenbashi on Sep 20, 2007 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0

Seems he'd fit in well in the old Sea of Red.
LET'S GO TRIBE
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
- The 1-10 disaster of 2006, is now the staff's #2 pitcher and leading the AL in ERA.
- Sowers and Lee struggled so much that they were booted out of the rotation.
- Westbrook was injured for a while.
p.s: I was never on the Tigers bandwagon though. Too many things went right for them last year. I actually thought the White Sox would be our nemesis for the division. Clearly wrong on that one.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
2.19 CLE Carmona
2.68 CLE Sabathia
2.91 BOS Beckett
3.23 NYY Pettitte
3.43 LAA Lackey
3.45 CLE Westbrook
3.55 BOS Schilling*
3.83 LAA Escobar
4.14 LAA Weaver
4.21 LAA Saunders
4.29 CLE Byrd
4.39 NYY Wang
4.45 BOS Lester*
4.45 BOS Clemens*
4.73 LAA ESantana*
5.05 BOS Wakefield
5.37 BOS Matsuzaka
5.52 NYY Mussina
* technically does not have enough IP to qualify
Nine weeks of data, take it as you will.
What it says to me is:
- We have the best two starters.
- Even if you took away Carmona or Sabathia, we would still have the best three-man rotation.
- Not only that Westbrook is our Game Three starter, but he possibly would be the Game Two starter for any of the other teams.
- Our worst straight slot-vs-slot matchup would be Byrd vs. Saunders, 4.29 vs. 4.21.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Beckett is narrowly edging CC right now, but both's FIP are remarkably close to their actual ERA. By this measure, Santana, Carmona, Lackey, and Haren have all been lucky to get to their super low ERAs. I also checked Westbrook's history to see if groundball pitchers have a naturally higher FIP, but there was no evidence to suggest this. Ditto for Webb. Anyway, interesting food for thought I guess.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
http://www.hardballtimes.com/thtstats/main/index.php?view=pitching&league_filter[0]=1&orderBy=fip&direction=ASC&page=1
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
here's the html:
http://www.hardballtimes.com/thtstats/main/index.php?view=pitching&league_filter[0]=1&orderBy=fip&direction=ASC&page=1
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0

You think you have "Link issues"?????
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
This was a quick and dirty list. I doubt using a more accurate stat would change it much. All these pitchers are in the same league, and it happens that their four home parks have been the four highest run-scoring environments in that league this season.
If they have a more specific point to make, let them make it.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
I'll be drinking one or two or twelve for all the Tribe fans when it happens.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
by Turkmenbashi on Sep 20, 2007 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
In 2001 my father and I did the Fancast in the broadcasting booth during the 7th inning of that game. On the elevator down, we were with Rick Manning as he made his way to the clubhouse with a mic in hand. I told him this was all very exciting and he said, "You betcha." He signed my dad's scorecard. It was all pretty swell.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
So, I think I'll put in my two weeks tomorrow. I can't work with "people" like that. I'd rather he made fun of my dead grandmother than bring up the '97 series.
No offense, but remind your "friend"
So, it's not like we're the only ones who "choke" - so have the "great" (and yes, I'm being sarcastic here) Yankees.
Just my 2 cents.
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
These were great insights. It's almost scary how close they are to those
of Anthony Castrovince on indians.com.
BTW, yours are time stamped. His are not. Perhaps he's a fan?
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Derrick Cleveland Ohio: Did Cleveland basically clinch it last night? First Cavs, here comes the Tribe, and let's go Browns!
Joe Morgan: Well no one has clinched, but they are in better position and if you are a betting man you are feeling good about Cleveland. But Cleveland could lose a couple here, so don't get ahead of yourself. Obviously Cleveland looks good, but the Mets looked good a week ago.
KT: Yes, let's not get ahead of ourselves. For example, this site says that there is only a 99.96% chance of the Indians making the playoffs. So be cool, everyone. No celebrating yet.
http://www.firejoemorgan.com/2007/09/joseph-leonard-chat-morgan.html
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
"That's how bad."
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
a) Morgan thinks that the word is concetrate and not concentrate
b) Joe is totally obsessed with Gary Sheffield. I laugh uincontrollably every time Ken Tremendous points it out
No offense, but if this was Wednesday morning,
Hello NickFantana,
Even if the Tigers had won that 3rd game, the lead still would have been 5.5 games, the magic number would have been 5 (now 4 after tonight's game,) and the Indians would still be a pretty strong bet to clinch the AL Central.
Just my 2 cents. :-)
Re: Series in Review: Cleveland 3, Detroit 0
Hope I can redeem myself Saturday night, in addition to watching the division be clinched.

by 
















