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Spring Training Roundup

While 24-year Andy Marte has garnered quite a bit of attention from both management and the fans, another youngster is quietly preparing for his first full season in the majors:

Gutierrez is only 25, but it seems as if he should be older. This will be his fifth season in the Indians' organization since being acquired from the Dodgers for Milton Bradley on April 4, 2004.

He has never had this kind of chance before. Trot Nixon is gone and the Indians didn't bring in another veteran outfielder to cloud the picture. Right field is waiting for him.

At this time last year, we were saying many of the same things last year about Gutierrez that we are about Marte this spring. Gutierrez was once a highly-rated prospect dealt to the Indians. He initially struggled to make the transition from the high minors to the majors. Well, his defense was never an issue, but you can see the parallels.

That doesn't mean that Franklin is a finished product, though. He hit just .232/.292/.429 against right-handed pitching last season, and his strikeout-to-walk ratio (77 to 21) is too high for my tastes. But even with those drawbacks, his defensive ability makes him already a decent right fielder.

*****************

If you're an Indians' beat writer looking for a story, just walk on over to Travis Hafner, or in this case, his wife Amy:

"Did you know he was a Mathlete?" Amy asks. "He's really good at math. I bought some pens the other day, and I was trying to figure out how much they were per pen. I told him the total price, and he was like, 'It's $2.36 a piece. Aren't you impressed?'

"I don't own a calculator, because I just ask Travis to do it for me."

It gets better.

"He's definitely afraid of needles," Amy says. "He once had to get an ingrown toenail removed, and my dad is a podiatrist. My dad had to give him a shot of Novocain. Travis was pouring with sweat.

"Honest to God, he almost fainted. He got out of the chair and ... you know how they put paper on the chair? The paper was like wet toilet paper."

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Comments

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Re: Spring Training Roundup
And little did people know that the "Project" portion of Pronk stood for math project...
Come back Joe Charboneau...

by cclemens31 on Mar 16, 2008 12:37 AM EDT reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
If he's that afraid of needles, I guess that can rule out those "B-12" injections into the buttocks.

by talonk on Mar 16, 2008 1:45 AM EDT reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Geez ... she really needs to shut the hell up.

by Jay on Mar 16, 2008 11:23 AM EDT reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
She's actually surprisngly hot.

by Joe on Mar 16, 2008 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Non sequitur of the month?  :-)
ken from alexandria

by ken from alexandria on Mar 16, 2008 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Why "suprisingly"?  He's basically a nice guy who is comfortably rich.  Try it some time.  I think you'll find you can do just fine out there.

I do know there are pictures of their wedding on some friends public picture page on-line.  Which I find very funny.  I don't think you would see Jeter's family pics up on some cousin's web page.

by dgcambridge on Mar 16, 2008 9:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Gutierrez is easily the tribe's best defender, and should be on the team just for that. But second years are often tough (ask Barfield or Peralta) and I can easily see him struggling. I'm sure the tribe will give him every chance to work through possible struggles. The funny thing is that the possibility of Gutierrez struggling actually affects Ben Francisco more than it does Gutierrez. If Gutierrez was totally established I could see the tribe trading Michaels (and possibly Dellucci) and having Francisco on the team. But without that it is too risky to start 2 young guys, and this is good conservative thinking by the FO.

by oxforddave on Mar 16, 2008 1:03 PM EDT reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
If basic division is the prerequisite for being a mathlete, this nation is in a sorry state.

by 7foot3 on Mar 16, 2008 1:23 PM EDT reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Wow..who took the gem out of your donut?
I'm not superstitious, I'm just a little stitious.

by jakesinger777 on Mar 16, 2008 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
you mean jam?

I'm just shocked that that line is somehow considered a noteworthy quote.

by 7foot3 on Mar 16, 2008 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
gem, jam - the accents are pretty tough and any line from snatch is a noteworthy quote.  
I'm not superstitious, I'm just a little stitious.

by jakesinger777 on Mar 16, 2008 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
just helping a buddy out, and when i awakened from my drunken st patty's stupor, i watched it again, just because you mentioned the quote.

by 7foot3 on Mar 19, 2008 12:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
You're reading it wrong.  She said he was a mathlete, and then went on to talk about how in everyday life he does division quickly in his head.  I missed the part where she said, "Travis became a mathlete because he can do division."  I'm confident it's easier to find an everyday example where division is used than finding the cosine of something.

by nickjs21 on Mar 16, 2008 9:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Granted I'm basing my account on others, but does it seem like Marte doesn't care anymore.  Others have come to camp trying to improve this or that including Gutz.  Does that mean a work ethic works, no.  But it does more than nothing.  They could have everything else in the world in common, but if one doesn't have a decent work ethic they rally don't have anything in common.  I take comfort knowing he's trying to get better.  A slump may be around the corner, but by working hard now it means the Tribe will be more willing to let him work through it.  Or maybe not. If it's a tough race and the Michucci monster somehow works, then Ben might be called up to give the Tribe a boast.  With Josh, it seemed like they did not want to wait toward the end (tight divisional race).  With Jhonny, the Tribe wasn't in a tight race so they were more likely to let him figure things out.  If Gutz struggles, it depends on position the team is in on whether he stays in the majors or is demoted.

On another note, I think the Hafner giggling at attacking Dellucci did worse for my perspective of Pronk.  He likely doesn't do that, but that image will be the image I have burned into my head when he comes up to bat.

Texas největší mimo Tribe fanda.

by kova on Mar 16, 2008 2:13 PM EDT reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Aside from the issue of his conditioning, I don't know why you'd say that about Marte.  He's only struck out 4 times in 40 plate appearances.  He's got 6 walks and 6 extra-base hits...Those all seem like positive improvements.

by APV on Mar 16, 2008 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
It's mostly conditioning.  From my experience, if you don't care about conditioning, it bleeds to other sections of your workout and ethic.  It hasn't now, but I think it will in a month or so.  He is more patient at the plate, I'll give you that.  He minimizing swings at junk, but I just don't believe that he deserves the start or he's arrived.  But for his extra base hits, it's usually the only hits he has in a game.  Yeah a Grand Slam feels great, but to think that if he doesn't hit a home run, then it's likely an out is not a thought I want to have with Marte.  

Or his success could be that he doesn't care about the pressure any more and it has worked.  This can be dangerous, because when he struggles he might tense up.  

He just hasn't convinced he that he is what was advertised.  

Texas největší mimo Tribe fanda.

by kova on Mar 16, 2008 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Some where Babe Ruth is giggling.
"the most vehement Yankee-hating guy I know" - Jay

by mauichuck on Mar 16, 2008 7:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Every plate appearance is a likely out, for every player in almost every season.  So every grand slam is a likely out if it doesn't leave the year.

for his extra base hits, it's usually the only hits he has in a game.

Well, you're basically criticizing him for having a high isolated power (total bases per hit).  I mean, I kind of get where you're coming from, I think you're worried about him making solid, consistent contact.  But you acknowledged that he's more patient, and when you're launching doubles and home runs, that is kind of solid contact.  So what else is there to worry about really?  You want him to choke up on the bat more, practice shooting it through the 5.5 hole like Tony Gwynn, bunt?

There are hardly any true genuine bat control guys left, and Marte sure isn't going to be one of them no matter what he does.  He's a take-and-rake guy, and you have to admit, he's taking and he's raking.  I personally am pro-grand-slam as a rule, but what do I know.

by Jay on Mar 16, 2008 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
... if it doesn't leave the yard.  I don't think Bonds or Ruth or anyone else has sent balls hurtling across time just yet -- but who knows, the chemists are just getting warmed up.

by Jay on Mar 16, 2008 8:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
well, you know, particles on the ball technically do travel forward in time compared to how we see them.

by sandwich on Mar 16, 2008 8:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
What are you, some kinda scientist or sumpin'?

Yo Joey, Daisuke has this pitch called the gyroball which literally defies physics. How you gonna explain that one, huh?

by jhon on Mar 17, 2008 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
There's a golf course on the border between Sweden and Finland. If you arrange your tee-time carefully (mid-summer, after 11:00 p.m., under the midnight sun), you can drive the ball into next week (i.e., a different time zone). Still, hitting it out of the year would be hard, given meterological conditions on any given December 31.
ken from alexandria

by ken from alexandria on Mar 17, 2008 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
"He just hasn't convinced he that he is what was advertised."

This is neither here nor there.  I think most people would agree that Marte hasn't lived up to his billing, but that doesn't mean he shouldn't start.  The only pertinent question the brass need to decide is whether or not his starting makes us a better team than our other options.

by ClarkM on Mar 16, 2008 9:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Not even close. We're at 1231 now and kova's been here for a while. But the conditioning stuff is a tad preachy.

by supermarioelia on Mar 17, 2008 9:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Yeah, you'd think these guys were preparing for a triatholon or sumtin'.
"the most vehement Yankee-hating guy I know" - Jay

by mauichuck on Mar 17, 2008 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
I think it's also being overplayed.  When Hector Luna came to camp basically looking fat, they more or less came right out and said so.  With Marte, they said more than once that he wasn't in bad shape, just not in especially good shape, which they had hoped he would be.

I'm not pleased about it, but it shouldn't be exaggerated into something it's not.

by Jay on Mar 17, 2008 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
You have to admit it's a possibility.  Only it would mean that he's not back under a new fake name, but actually has done something to another poster.  I'm officially afraid now.

by dgcambridge on Mar 17, 2008 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
To clarify: lower ID number = more senior poster
Higher ID = relative newby
"the most vehement Yankee-hating guy I know" - Jay

by mauichuck on Mar 17, 2008 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
I am curious, how do I find the user ID numbers, I would like to know what mine is

by Roger Dorn on Mar 17, 2008 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Just hold your mouse over your name.  You and I aren't too far apart, I believe.

by nickjs21 on Mar 18, 2008 8:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Right click on your name and choose "Properties"  that'll tell ya.
"the most vehement Yankee-hating guy I know" - Jay

by mauichuck on Mar 18, 2008 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
BTW Voltair, what's a Boof Bonser fan doin' on an Indians-centric website?
"the most vehement Yankee-hating guy I know" - Jay

by mauichuck on Mar 17, 2008 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Being an Indians fan (thanks for explaining the numbers, guys). I was a Boof Bonser fan when he was with the Giants. He got traded to the Twins after the fact - believe me, when he starts against the Tribe I root for him to get slammed.

But trust me - I'm an Indians fan all the way. Boof is comparatively waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay down here on the ladder of "how much I care".

by Voltaire on Mar 18, 2008 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
In all of those scenarios, the team's moves were dictated as much by what they thought of their next-best-option as by what they thought of the player in question.

Jhonny was left in not just because there was no race, but because we had no other good options anyway.

Barfield was yanked not just because of the race, but because a viable option presented itself in Cabrera.

Gutierrez will not be demoted because he's out of options.  But he will lose playing time if he struggles, and unlike Marte or Barfield, he's very useful as a backup, since he plays a fine CF and has speed.  In fact, if Gutierrez struggles, he may well lose time to Marte, with Blake starting in RF more often.

There's no getting around the fact that there's no room on the roster for Francisco, and once Choo comes back, we'll have to let someone go if nobody is injured, and even after letting someone go, we still won't have room for Francisco.  Francisco is waiting on injuries, trades and DFAs, plain and simple.  No mere benching or demotion can put him on the 25-man roster.

by Jay on Mar 16, 2008 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
That's a sad fate for the 2007 International League's "Most Exciting Player." I wonder if Francisco and Barton will become the BP-type players we'll someday wish we still had.

BTW, Barton is hitting .349 for the Cards in SP, and his .674 slugging is second on the team, behind some guy named Pujols.

by kov on Mar 17, 2008 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
I feel your anguish, but it's misplaced.  BP was widely considered an elite prospect, and he was later labeled a bust before he turned it around.  We gave him away before his 25th birthday.

Francisco has never, ever been considered an elite prospect or even an A-rated prospect, despite meaningless accolades like "most exciting."  We will use only his second option this season, meaning won't be forced into a BP-type decision with him until March 2010 at the earliest.

As for Barton, the Indians could call up the Cardinals and offer any other outfielder on our 40-man roster for him, and they'd probably accept.  Yes, including Michaels and Dellucci and possibly even Choo.  All he's done is play well in Double-A at ages 24-25 -- not extremely well, either, just well.

Like Willy Taveras, Barton may turn out to be a passable National League outfielder.  It would have been nice to keep him, but it's hard to imagine something we need less than a speedy outfielder who hasn't mastered Triple-A yet.  This couldn't be more different than the situation with BP, where we actually had a lack of depth at his position on top of everything else.

by Jay on Mar 17, 2008 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
I don't disagee with Jay, and the Barton/Francisco
discussion is not a hill I want to die on. However, the comparison to Taveras begs a little more analysis.

Both Barton (6'3", 187lbs) and Francisco (6',180 lbs) are much stronger than Taveras (6',160lbs)and hit HRs in the minors at a clip of about 17 per full season vs less than 3 for Taveras.

Taveras is probably much faster than the other two, but I'd take either of them in a foot race over Dellucci/Michaels by a wide margin.

by kov on Mar 17, 2008 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Wow, never thought I'd be in the position of defending Willy Taveras.  I actually took a spare moment the other day to edit his Wikipedia entry to emphasize what a terrible power hitter he is.

Taveras didn't stay in the minors past age 22, and power blooms much later than that.  Still, ages 21 and 22, Taveras had 4 HR and Francisco 26, in about the same number of games and at the same levels, so the difference is clear enough.  (Just to make sure we're comparing apples to apples, I'm going to adjust everything in the minors to per-150-games.)

But Francisco's clip of 18 HR/150 games is not exactly impressive, and he hit a fair amount of doubles but not a ton, and they didn't turn into HR.  Bottom line, age 25 in Triple-A, he came close to 500 slugging but didn't quite get there, and we are talking about a corner OF.

Taveras earns his spot -- barely -- by virtue of his speed on the bases and range in the field, and he is an elite player in these areas.  Francisco is not even considered an adequate CF, let alone a CF with elite range.  We might be dismissive of Taveras' value if it was only stealing bases -- in fact I am somewhat dismissive of it -- but he does translate it into plus CF defense, which is valuable in and of itself.

As for Barton, at those same levels (A+ and AA), he hit only 30 HR in 294 games, or 15 HR/150.  But unlike the other two, he didn't do it at ages 21-22, he did it at ages 23-25 -- "once he got his man muscles," to use Torii Hunter's memorable phrase.  I won't try to argue that Taveras could have matched those numbers at the same age, but it's possible.  More to the point, Francisco hit considerably better -- 19 HR/150 -- at ages 24-25, and he did it in Triple-A.  And Barton is a little bit too old for us to start guessing that his doubles will become homers, especially as he jumps from Double-A to the majors (or at least the NL Central).

As for speed, Barton stole 80 bases over three full seasons in the minors, 34 SB/150 and he was at the peak ages for speed, 23-25.  Taveras stole 166 bases in his last three minor league seasons, 83 SB/150, and did it at less ideal ages for pure speed, 20-22.  So we're talking about two totally different degrees of speed here, such that whatever edge Barton may have in power -- less than you think -- Taveras surely has that much of an edge in speed.

My point being, Barton very much should be grouped  with Taveras in terms of overall value, and Francisco is definitely a notch higher.  That said, the fact that we can even compare Francisco to the other two tells you something.

by Jay on Mar 17, 2008 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Very good analysis Jay. As I think about this more, a better comparison for Barton (size, speed, power) may be Gutz instead of Taveras.

by kov on Mar 17, 2008 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Thank you.  I don't see Gootz and Barton as being a similar type of player, however, let alone similar caliber.  The size and speed, yes, the power, no.

Gutierrez had terrific seasons at age 20 and 21, through Double-A, but was pretty clearly another Alex Escobar waiting to happen -- awesome range and arm in the field, huge power stroke and way too many strikeouts.  So they basically have spent three whole seasons trying to change him into a totally different kind of hitter -- frankly, more like Ben Francisco -- because as nice as the big bombs are, Escobar is barely a major leaguer at all after five years of trying.

This makes Gutierrez a really intriguing guy, for two reasons.  One, have you ever heard of this kind of transformation actually working?  Do you know how many toolsy prospects in history have busted in the exact same way as Escobar did and Gutierrez would have?  It seems like it would be an amazing achievement for both the player and the system if they have pulled it off.

And the second reason is, there's the fringe chance that he can master the new hitting approach and then eventually find his old power-swat and combine them together, as he hits his late-20's, and at that point, maybe you have a monster hitter on your hands.  For now, though, I'll settle for a .350 OBP, plus the D.

I see Barton as a more typical hitter with a balance of contact skills, speed and just a bit of pop.

by Jay on Mar 17, 2008 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Let's visit the Barton/Gutz minor-league power numbers to see if they are similar. Jay calculated Barton at 15 HR per 150 games. I calculate Gutz to be at 17.8 HR per 150  games. Those seem similar to me.

Also, those numbers seem like more than just a bit of pop. They could be closer to 25 HR per season over 162 games later in their careers when the "man muscles" show up (or Julio Franco can show them how he did it in just one winter).

by kov on Mar 17, 2008 9:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
andrew left out the spaces here.

it should read: agea gea geage ge ag e

which is latin for: nanny nanny boo boo, our prospects are younger than you

by Brick. on Mar 17, 2008 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
On April 25, 1982, little baby Brian Barton came into the world. Less than 10 months later, Gu-Gu Gutz entered the playing field. Later in life, Brian spent more time in college becoming a rocket scientist while Gu-Gu was playing baseball.

Who has a better chance of becoming a baseball star? I don't know, but I wouldn't rule Barton out.

by kov on Mar 18, 2008 8:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
I think you are missing the point.  Gutierrez posted those power numbers at a younger age, than Barton.  At Gutierrez's age, it is thought that your strength isn't fully developed.  On the other hand, Barton was at the ages where it is thought that your strength is fully developed.  

At ages 23-25, Barton posted a career minor league isolated power of .159.  That is the definition of a little bit of pop, it's not that impressive.

by ClarkM on Mar 18, 2008 8:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
More impressive than Taveras's pop though.

I am not missing the point, but I believe you are missing mine. We have two players who are about the same age, so we are comparing their power numbers at roughly the same ages.

The BIG difference, as Jay clearly points out, is that Gutz has been producing his numbers at a higher level of competition, which makes him more of a proven player. That doesn't mean that Barton won't prove himself at the AAA or major league level; he just hasn't had the chance yet.

My only real point is that I hope we don't regret losing Barton someday. When Dellucci can't reach a fly ball, I'll be saying "Barton would have got that one" :-)

by kov on Mar 18, 2008 9:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
I would submit to you that if we're going to look at home runs in isolation, a two-year age difference is more significant than on eor two levels.  (Actually, the parks enter into this way more than we're acknowledging, too.)

Barton has always been rather old for his level, owing to his late start at 22.9 and the Indians' outfield depth in the high minors.  These things are not his fault per se, but the fact remains that he was playing against much weaker pitching than other notable prospects.

To further dissect, Barton had mid-season promotions each year, meaning that he started each year kind of extra-old for his level and ended each year merely kinda-old.

In his extra-old stints, he had 16.8 HR/150.

In his kinda-old stints, he had 11.5 HR/150.

It's almost impossible to compare this directly with Gootz, whose career has been so different.  The best you can do is to look only at A+ and AA rates, since they each played a chunk of games at those levels.

Gootz - 40 HR, 297 games = 20.2 HR/150, age 20-22
Barton - 30 HR, 294 games = 15.3 HR/150, age 23-25

The difference in strength between a player at age 20-22 and age 23-25 can't really be overstated; understanding that difference is fundamental to evaluating young prospects.  That said, Gutierrez was a different style of hitter then and had to re-tool his whole approach.  Barton still is that same hitter, for whatever that's worth.

Also worth noting, Gootz hit 92 doubles and triples in those games, Barton only 65, even though Barton has at least a little speed edge, and that's in the same ballpark as their relative HR production.

When Dellucci can't reach a fly ball, I'll be saying "Barton would have got that one" :-)

Here's my only problem with that.  When Dellucci can't reach that fly ball, we'll probably have two other players on our bench at that moment, and probably another two in Buffalo, who would have gotten to that flyball just as Barton would have.  So it's never really going to be about losing Barton, it's really just going to be about choosing who should be in the lineup that day.

by Jay on Mar 18, 2008 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
I can't disagree with anything Jay said, other than there is a 10-month age difference rather than 2 years.

Since we don't have a power-hitting star in LF now, I fondly look back at the second 1/2 of 2007 when we had 3 center fielders in the OF and the defensive ground they covered (not to mention the base running benefit). Thus, I am partial to guys like Barton, Choo, and Francisco rather than our Dellucci/Michaels platoon.

There, I've now offically died on this hill!

by kov on Mar 18, 2008 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Wow, you really have, too.  I think you should at least make room for Michaels in your all-CF-outfield conceptual mancrush, which, by the way, I very much share.  Michaels may well be better defensively than any of the three younguns you named.

I didn't mean to imply that Gootz is two (or even three) years younger than Barton, sorry if that wasn't clear.  He is of course ten months younger as you say, but also more accomplished.

What I did mean to say is that Gootz was nearly three years younger than Barton was duringn their 290-game tenures in A+ and AA.  Barton hit A+ right after his 23rd birthday and played his last games for Akron three months after turning 25.  Gootz hit A+ six weeks after his 20th birthday and played his last games for Akron four months after turning 22.

by Jay on Mar 18, 2008 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
/ Do you know how many toolsy prospects in history have busted in the exact same way as Escobar did/

let's remember that Escobar missed just about all of 1999 with a back injury and all of 2002 with his knee. I don't want to be that guy that claims Escobar would have been great, but bad backs and knees in your early 20s are a serious detriment on the career.

by 7foot3 on Mar 19, 2008 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
I would agree with the basic point that Escobar's development was hampered by his injury, but it's hard to see that it was fatal to his career.  He did, after all, come back to have 575 PA in 2003, leading the International League in HR in the process.

The following year, he looked great out in RF in the majors and was racking up outfield assists at a furious pace -- he finished with 9 in only 46 games, while the AL leader finished with 13 in a full season.

Neither leading the IL in home runs (at age 24) nor the AL in outfield assists (at age 25) directly disproves a lingering knee injury, but you certainly need to put a lot of weight on that knee to hit with any power, or to get to a flyball in the field quickly enough to gun down a runner.

So I would submit to you that though delayed, Escobar did get healthy, and simply could not make enough contact to be a major league regular.

by Jay on Mar 19, 2008 1:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Forgot to mention in my Friday post after the Nationals game that Alex Escobar made an appearance in the lineup as a non-roster invitee for the Nats....120/.160/.233/ for the spring.

by supermarioelia on Mar 19, 2008 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
All I know about Escobar is that at the one Phillie game I went to last year he hit a bomb and looked like he'd been lifting weights and during crunches for the last ten years.
"the most vehement Yankee-hating guy I know" - Jay

by mauichuck on Mar 19, 2008 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Shouda added that he was playing for the Nats at the time.
"the most vehement Yankee-hating guy I know" - Jay

by mauichuck on Mar 19, 2008 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
But you can do so much more than crunches to exercise your core... //You can do side bends and situps. But please don't lose that butt.
Sportsman of the year, 1991

by BostonWahoo on Mar 19, 2008 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
It's too bad about Escobar. It finally looked like things were coming together in 2006 w/ the Nats.  He might have been a great player.  

He'll be 30 this season.  Safe to say he missed his shot at stardom, but I'd like to have him back in Buffalo if he's available and healthy.  

by jhon on Mar 19, 2008 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
"really coming together" = superficial 391 BABIP over 99 PA

Normalized:  818 OPS.  Really.

by Jay on Mar 19, 2008 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
The scouting report section on Taveras looks like your doing

by Roger Dorn on Mar 17, 2008 9:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
At least now we know what the secret injury was.

by FranklinScott on Mar 16, 2008 6:04 PM EDT reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Anyone have a question for Baseball Prospectus writers Clay Davenport, Steven Goldman, or Jay Jaffe?  Chuck, I know you've got plenty.  I'm going to drop a little chat and pizza thing they're having in DC tonight, at Dave's suggestion.  It won't be the most socially dynamic function in the universe, but it's Monday night in the nerdiest of the big cities in America, so I'm going.  Turk's going.  Marble, you in?  Anyone else?

by jhon on Mar 17, 2008 11:22 AM EDT reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Washington DC "the nerdiest....city in America" huh?  I dunno.  Bostom maybe or how about San Francisco?

I really can't give you any canned questions, but I'd love to be there to here how these guys think.  Unfortunately I'm in Maui right now and not due back to the Princeton until the first of next week - maybe I'll make the next one.

"the most vehement Yankee-hating guy I know" - Jay

by mauichuck on Mar 17, 2008 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Well, it has to be up there.

Doesn't look like they're dropping by Maui.  Here's she schedule.  I'd ask them something about Pronk, but I think that subject's pretty well covered here.  I'm thinking of a Ben Francisco or bullpen question, or maybe something about defense up the middle.  

by jhon on Mar 17, 2008 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
*the, not she.

I have a little corned beef stuck in my teeth. I don't actually have a lisp.

by jhon on Mar 17, 2008 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Oy make that Boston for Bostom and hear for here - it's early here and "Major League" is on TBS.  I just thought of one.  Ask 'em if they have a track record on their projections.  
"the most vehement Yankee-hating guy I know" - Jay

by mauichuck on Mar 17, 2008 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Thanks for the invite and info, jhon, but I'm in France at the moment with the Fiancee.  I'll be back next week - we should all get together before the season starts.  Let me know if anything likes this pops up again...
Now that the Bedard bandwagon has officially crashed into the Maritime Seas, solely the local "Barfield Bounces Back Believer."

by mjmarble on Mar 18, 2008 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
This Wedge quote this morning seemed a little weird to me:

"I don't like to platoon, but if that's the way my personnel sets up, then you've got to do it," said Wedge.

Now maybe he's only talking about Gutierrez's shot as the full-time RF starter (which he addresses later in the article), but I thought he was OK with the LF situation.  A couple of weeks ago he said:

"I really feel like with David Dellucci, if he can stay healthy, I think he's going to have a good year for us. He's a good hitter. He's a proven major league hitter. I think early on last year, he tried to do too much. ... Jason Michaels, we've got a pretty good idea of what he's all about. He does a heck of a job against left-handed pitchers. He's really committing to try to be that much better against right-handed pitchers. So I think you add that together, I think that we'll do much better out there in left field."

I know the latter quote is the sort of generic sping "rah-rah" you expect.  He's never come out and been so critical about the platoon before, though, has he?

I suppose I'm reading too much into all this, but it is still March and I'm ready for the season to start.

by mkwng @ Let's Go Tribe! on Mar 17, 2008 11:26 AM EDT reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
I wouldn't read too much into it. Wedge gets microphones stuck in his face every day and he has to say something; eventually he'll contradict himself.

Probably the reason he doesn't like platooning is it just means he has two egos to worry about at a given position instead of one, and can't just fill out the lineup card the same way every day.

by mrich on Mar 17, 2008 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
More Weglarz love from Baseball America.

The money quote for those who are too lazy to click the link:

"He hit a line-drive home run in the Korea game that the first baseman jumped at to try to reach the ball," Puhl said. "I'm talking about shooting it out of a shotgun--it's scary. I'm still waiting for the day when he gets all of one with backspin on it. I see them in batting practice and its incredible how hard he can hit the ball. But this guy's going to get bigger and stronger, going to get a bit of a better idea of how to elevate the ball."

by APV on Mar 20, 2008 4:04 PM EDT reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Is it too soon to copyright Weglarz Reglarz?
ken from alexandria

by ken from alexandria on Mar 20, 2008 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Re: Spring Training Roundup
Let's just rename the team now.  We can be the Cleveland Canadians, with the new mascot Chief Weglarz.

by Jay on Mar 21, 2008 2:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

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